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FactorFiction,
Thanks for stopping by !
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 6:25 PM
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Mandalee,
Thanks.
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 6:22 PM
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You are such a Man.
And I don't mean that in a good way.
posted by
FactorFiction
on March 12, 2007 at 6:16 PM
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posted by
Amanda__
on March 12, 2007 at 2:48 PM
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Troosha ,
Thanks for clarifying . You have a strong point to argue and you have done it very nicely . Thanks.
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 12:26 PM
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Let me clarify…. I didn’t say women are exploited by choice. They are exploited by belief systems, by others obsessed with power and control (societies or individuals), and their resulting fear and inability to stand their own ground without facing grave consequences. Religion is guilty, societies are guilty, and the twisted attitude of some men is also a contributing factor. No one choses abuse or exploitation but they may become mired in circumstances that preclude them from rising above.
posted by
Troosha
on March 12, 2007 at 12:22 PM
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Bhaskar,
Thanks for participating .
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 12:21 PM
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Afzal
That is just a part viewpoint but not the whole.The idea also seems at variance with its beginning and its end.
posted by
Bhaskar.ing
on March 12, 2007 at 12:19 PM
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I agree with you .
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 12:08 PM
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The purpose of religion
To control the masses. There is nothing inherently good about religion. It has outlived it's usefullness. People need to learn to control themselves and they cannot do so while repressive religions seek to control their lives for them.
posted by
Whysper
on March 12, 2007 at 12:06 PM
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Dolls-43,
Thanks.
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 12:02 PM
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Obscenity and Woman
Many Women are their own person!
posted by
Dolls-43
on March 12, 2007 at 12:01 PM
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Troosha ,
I do agree with you what you say here . I am happy you have participated and take keen interest in the subject but you have not thrown light over the exploitation that women go through even in modern societies .You mean to say it is their choice and not compulsion that they chose to be exploited in modern times.
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 11:59 AM
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Sunny,
Thanks for sharing the relgious directions . You have enlightened me .
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 11:55 AM
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Afzal
As with much of the Bible, some background information is helpful for interpreting these passages:
- Biblical-era society was very much male-dominated. The status of women was much like that of children today -- totally subservient to the male head-of-household. It would have been considered scandalous and an affront to the sanctity of worship for a woman to take a leadership role. Not only were women prohibited from taking any role that would appear to be dominant over men, they were urged to dress modestly (1 Timothy 2:9-10) and wear their hair long (1 Corinthians 11:15) according to the customs of the time. Both men and women were urged to observe the gender-appropriate conventions for head coverings (1 Corinthians 11:4-7).
- Biblical-era women were not educated and were confined to domestic duties. A woman would not have had the education needed to take a teaching role.
- The young Christian communities in the Mediterranean area were already looked upon as hotbeds of dangerous heretics by the pagan majorities. The apostle Paul and other church leaders were very concerned about avoiding any appearance of scandal that would make a bad impression on the people they wanted to convert to Christianity (Titus 2:3-8, 1 Corinthians 14:22-24), or worse, that could be used to justify persecution of Christians. Much of Paul's writing is concerned with instructing Christians in proper behavior and correcting problems within the Church (1 Corinthians 5:1-2, 1:10, 11:18-22, etc.)
- Humility is an important theme throughout the New Testament; suffering for our faith in this life will bring great rewards in the life to come. Virtue comes from obedience to God, not from rebelling against society's norms (1 Peter 2:13-17). Thus, slaves should accept freedom if offered, but, if not, should be obedient to their masters in all things (1 Corinthians 7:20-24, Colossians 3:22-24, 1 Peter 2:18-21). Similarly, women should not rebel against their lot in life (1 Peter 3:1-6).
http://www.twopaths.com/faq_women.htm
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on March 12, 2007 at 11:54 AM
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There is nothing intrinsic to the West that causes the general degradation of women, no matter what you want to believe, and there is nothing intrinsic to Islam that causes the general degradation of women, regardless of what most Westerners believe. Frankly, both systems are equally flawed. Frankly, both systems are equally flawed. And they are flawed because human beings are obsessed with power and control, and inflicting fear is one way of asserting power and control over women. So actually, yeah, there is something intrinsic to Islam and to the West that lead to the degradation of human beings - it’s called human beings.
posted by
Troosha
on March 12, 2007 at 11:52 AM
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Afzal
As in all the congregations of the saints, women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church.(NIV, 1 Corinthians 14:33-35)
A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.(NIV, 1 Timothy 2:11-12)
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on March 12, 2007 at 11:52 AM
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Sunny,
I will check it . Thanks.
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 11:51 AM
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Afzal
It's in the Bible
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on March 12, 2007 at 11:50 AM
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Sunny,
Is it anywhere written in any the Holy Bible or is it that you are talking from your experience of wrong practice by the followers . Why blame religion when you can't find any directive as to exploitation of women and children in the holy treatises .
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 11:49 AM
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Afzal
What I am saying that the majority of the ill treatment towards women IS because of religion.
Some of it is just because of the cruelty of certain men.
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on March 12, 2007 at 11:47 AM
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Afzal
Afzal, I have to somewhat disagree with you there. I don't know how things work in ALL religions, but I know that in Christianity, it was formed to make the woman subservient to man. Children too.
A man could do anything he desires to his wife and children, and they have no rights.... that is how it was set up in the beginning.
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on March 12, 2007 at 11:46 AM
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Sunny,
I agree with you but it is not the religion which is to be blamed for ill treatment meted out to women but the men who violate the laws of religion who are to be blamed.
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 11:39 AM
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oh, come now Pat
You're not insinuating that the choice here is to be exploited by one individual or be exploited by the masses, are you?
Cause if you're not, you should be. That is precisely what many of the predominant religions had in mind. As long as the woman is controlled(exploited) by her husband, she would not interfere in the bigger scheme of things.
posted by
Whysper
on March 12, 2007 at 11:37 AM
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Pat B,
You have raised a valid point here . Thanks.
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 11:37 AM
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Afzal
Not all religions hold women in high reguard. Actually, the majority of religions that I know about, were formed with the intent to have men rule over women.
As for the rest....women are exploited in this world because men rule it. Men want to see women, nude and degraded, therefore they create pornography, etc.
Here, women still get paid less money for doing the same job and the same work that a man does.
It is a sad thing, and I don't think it's ever going to change that easily.
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on March 12, 2007 at 11:34 AM
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Is it better to be a "tool of capitalism" and have control over your life
or should a woman stay dependent upon a man, "barefoot and pregnant" as the saying goes, beholden to him for the bread she puts in her mouth, serving him and waiting on him, bent to whatever whim he may have about how her life should be?
I know what my choice would be.
posted by
Pat_B
on March 12, 2007 at 11:32 AM
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Should have been not sure I found.....
posted by
Whysper
on March 12, 2007 at 11:24 AM
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Hm, sure I found much of anything that I can agree with in this post
There are very few religions where women have been offered equality to men. Certainly they are given places of honor, in exchange for any actual rights.
However, more to the point, capitalism is an economic machine which has no regard for moral, ethical or spiritual design. Capitalism allows for the exploitation of all who will allow it. It allows the marketplace to drive investment, production and prices. The fact that there is obscenity in capitalistic societies is merely a reflection of the marketplace not the economic machine.
The free market place is still the most fertile ground for development and innovation, and any attempt to censor that marketplace has only succeeded in spoiling the economy. You simply cannot legislate morality. No matter what your religous leaders want you to believe, the depravity of man will exist regardless of the economic structure we operate under.
posted by
Whysper
on March 12, 2007 at 11:23 AM
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Troosha,
I found your view quite aggressive so I thought I should leave it for some other time to discuss more coolly . I am sorry I did not respond to it immediately . I find much weight in your argument .I was also waiting for some other views to come so that I could get a clear picture of different and opposing thoughts . Thanks for your extensive critical comment .
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 11:16 AM
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With all due respect… I didn’t “stop by”. Stopping by is leaving a or a 
. By contrast, I carefully read your post, took the time to reflect upon your opinion, and then carefully composed my thoughts which, in this instance, happen to be an apposing view. I thought it might invite further clarification from you. Guess not....
posted by
Troosha
on March 12, 2007 at 11:10 AM
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rihwik.lancs,
Thanks.
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 10:54 AM
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comment
i agree with you.beauty and sex used to make [?]social status by making money and public exposure of nudity.result,women have to forgo the pleasent experience of love and romance.
rithwik
posted by
rihwik.lancs
on March 12, 2007 at 10:50 AM
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Troosha,
Thanks for stopping by !
posted by
afzal50
on March 12, 2007 at 10:32 AM
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Yikes Afzal… capitalism is the degradation of women – now that’s a bit of a stretch, don’t you think??? Progress, changing times, and widening opportunities for women in the work place is not exploiting women – it’s providing them with choice and the potential to pursue whatever career they may desire. “Capitalism” has nothing to do women being victimized. They’ve been victimized and/or exploited for thousands of years for a myriad of reasons. An economic system which gives people the right to produce, trade, and yes, even profit has nothing to do with how society or a country as a whole treats women.
posted by
Troosha
on March 12, 2007 at 10:25 AM
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