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smartdog, I think that's sad,
and the irony about firefighters not being allowed to display the American flag in case local Muslims felt intimidated is that it's the AMERICAN flag. As Americans, that means it's their flag too. Or are people now threatened by their own national symbols? There's no logic to it, but then I suppose that's what we're talking about.
posted by
mneme
on October 18, 2006 at 3:30 PM
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Farsailor - what is that - Religionbusters?!
posted by
Antonionioni
on October 18, 2006 at 12:14 PM
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Thanks everyone for stopping and commenting.
I'll answer any questions individually (sorry, am very rushed tonite):
Mneme: I don't think there'll be a religious apocalyptic war on a global scale, but there will always be conflict, and those who live by the sword will die by it, or their relatives will. One example, not intended to show bias, but the first one that comes to mind. Hezbollah come out of Lebanon and kidnap 2 or 3 Israeli soldiers. Result: a load of Lebanese women, children and old men die in indiscriminate Israeli rocket fire. See the point? The starting point for those deaths was religious intolerance stoked up by warlike leaders on both sides. 'The mother of all battles' is, however, a remote possibility, but rather than a military mega-conflict, it's more accurately meant to mean a never-ending war of attrition between, say, Christians and Muslims where neither of the hawks in those two camps, because there are always many doves too, will ever accept each other as equally right. The main fault is to believe only one religion is right and the others are wrong. this leads to seeing the others as worse than yourself, and therefoore a legitimate target for military action, or attacks on the street, or slurs in the media.
posted by
Antonionioni
on October 18, 2006 at 12:13 PM
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Tony
Truly troubling times indeed. Here in America, not more than a few weeks after 9/11, firefighters in a small town were told they could not dipslay the american flag on their fire trucks because local muslims felt doing so was intended as a threat to them. Sad. Just sad.
I agree that leaders use religion (and anything else they can spin) as justification to increase their land, capital, power...
Well written,
-smartdog
posted by
smartdog_670
on October 18, 2006 at 10:59 AM
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Good piece, Tony. Challenging topic today.
posted by
_dave_says_ack_
on October 18, 2006 at 7:14 AM
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Thanks for sharing...
posted by
_Symphony_
on October 18, 2006 at 1:26 AM
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Isn't that something, Tonyzonit? There is so much jewelry made with religious symbols. Does that mean that a person can't wear earrings with a cross, or Star of David, etc. How about rings. What's with all of this? Can a fellow carry a rabbit foot in his pocket. In a way that is a bit "religious" too. Strange world we live in.
posted by
TAPS.
on October 17, 2006 at 9:00 PM
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weather is just showery with patches of sun.
the search for power is nothing new... however any religion solely based on fear would not last. I think it would die eventually.
posted by
marieclaire66
on October 17, 2006 at 6:46 PM
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Excellent thought provoking poem. Well done . Thanks.
posted by
afzal50
on October 17, 2006 at 6:45 PM
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WELL DONE
What would happen if a single symbol representing all spiritual beliefs were adopted, and everything else banned?
Ø
posted by
FARSAILOR
on October 17, 2006 at 5:55 PM
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Tony, it's and old joke but
the one thing I can't stand is intolerance. We try to live in peace and to be tolerant, yet I wonder how easy that can be when people are feeling so deprived and put down. Once they are told they are, that is. Hmmm. So many questions, there must be answers.
I'm wondering about the last two lines, what do you mean? Sounds apocalyptic...
To all believers, tolerate or die.
The mother of all battles could be nigh.
posted by
mneme
on October 17, 2006 at 5:41 PM
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Hi Tony
Scary, your verse make us pull our heads from the sand, same day different excuses and weapons still blind man. Well wrote friend
posted by
lionladroar
on October 17, 2006 at 3:48 PM
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Tony...appropo sonnet for our times...
....take a look at gomedome's piece from this morning...am enjoying your stuff...
posted by
FranklyMydear1
on October 17, 2006 at 2:48 PM
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Hi Marie-Claire
I know, I agree. But the actual history of the world shows that people become intolerant - often encouraged to do so by warlike leaders, against their inner, more peaceful nature, perhaps - of other people with differing views on religion. I think the leaders use religion as an excuse to go to war with those people who differ, to increase territory and power. The same is true of the persecution of ethnic minorities within a country. Religion is often used as the catalyst. It is not the original intention of the religion but, sadly, it's those religions that have been most warlike and aggressive in the past that are the most widespread today. Take South America. The Catholic religion was spread there by conquest and murder and fear. Anyway, this is getting a bit heavy! Has it been sunnier today where you are?
posted by
Antonionioni
on October 17, 2006 at 2:39 PM
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Thanks Nonconformist
All the best for now. I've enjoyed your contributions and will look for you again (if I'm still here!!)
posted by
Antonionioni
on October 17, 2006 at 2:35 PM
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Thanks, Chris.
For what it's worth, I think it'll all be sorted out peacefully in the end. No-one - well, not many people anyway - genuinely wants to die. As long as that remains true, we'll be OK.
posted by
Antonionioni
on October 17, 2006 at 2:19 PM
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religions are supposed to be about love not persecution
which ever sides it comes from, it is not the way God intended it to be.
posted by
marieclaire66
on October 17, 2006 at 2:18 PM
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Very well done. Who knows what to think these days?
Why are human beings so blind? I despair!
Just to let you know I am leaving blogit for a while but have a feeling I'll be back. (See post on my poetry site.) Thank you for many kind comments on my poetry.
posted by
nonconformist
on October 17, 2006 at 2:17 PM
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I really like this
It's getting a 'scarey old world'-isn't it.Well put.Chris
posted by
Scramble
on October 17, 2006 at 1:51 PM
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Thanks MC, Star and Troosha
I'm glad this hasn't been perceived as anti-Christian. It wasn't meant to be - just, really, a commentary on the problems of there being more than one major religion. Troosha, there are lots of examples of 'anti-Christian' rulings of this type. Of course, in a majority Christian or non-aligned country, they aren't intended that way - they are intended to placate non-Christians (wrongly, in my view). After all, the Muslim clothing issue has been the number one item in the news over here this last week, and covering faces with veils and wearing all-black gowns with only the eyes visible is of course far greater a visual symbol of one's religion than is a tiny cross on a necklace. But rather than taking sides, I'm saying that more than one religion, just as more than one opinion on anything between two or more people, and there will at some point be problems.
posted by
Antonionioni
on October 17, 2006 at 1:25 PM
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You gotta be kidding
How absurd. Setting aside the issue, your sonnet tells the inner nuances of the story boldly and beautifully.
posted by
Troosha
on October 17, 2006 at 12:59 PM
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nicely expressed
posted by
star4sky5
on October 17, 2006 at 12:53 PM
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Tony, such disturbing news...and trends developing.
Christians have been persecuted throughout history and it was common in Communist countries but now it is reaching our Western shores. Nothing new under the sun but it is a worry. I like these lines...well said.
We’ll fight firstly with words, then fists, then guns.
I know I’m right when I say the earth’s flat.
And on my land, the fool who says ‘round’ runs.
posted by
marieclaire66
on October 17, 2006 at 12:46 PM
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