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terpgirl30, I think you have got the point right .
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 9:45 PM
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Afzal The saints/sinners thing has evolved a bit but I'd
like to comment on the original post. You asked if by definition then aren't sinners more important than saints. It's a very interesting take on the direction given to help sinners. I don't think either is better or worse. I don't think any person is better or worse than another the broad sense of the word.
In the way you set out the facts that saints are to take care of the sinners, I only take that to mean that because in certain instances they are stronger, saints are entrusted with more responsibility. So one could argue that it's just the opposite...that saints are much more important as they are entrusted with taking care of the sinner.
In reality, however, I think one hand feeds the other. There are times when each of us plays the role of the saint and the sinner. I can't think of a single person who is all one way or another.
posted by
terpgirl30
on September 5, 2006 at 9:11 PM
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Plz. read "wants to meet her" .spelling error.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 7:17 PM
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lustorlove, plz don't worry , she has changed now . She is lucky to have a
lovely mother like you . Plz tell her that her uncle from India wants to me her to tell her how good her mother is.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 7:15 PM
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well my daughter knows I wouldnt steal a piece of gum and at times she has made fun of me, being so clean cut.
posted by
Lanetay
on September 5, 2006 at 7:11 PM
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Thanks, Sweetie.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 7:04 PM
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lustorlove , replace born instinctively with "lern instintively " to
make it more clear. Thanks.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 7:03 PM
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lustorlove , I wanted to say that moral values are not born instinctiely
but have to be taught and are taught otherwise whatever we did we would think that it is right to do so .
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 7:01 PM
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afzal
You're welcome, love. Anytime
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 7:00 PM
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posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:59 PM
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Sunny , you are a positive thinker , and very many thanks for participating
in this debate.It has been really nice talking to you this morning . You have provided me with great emotional support always when I needed .
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:59 PM
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sinner
I don't think that the definition of sinner and saint are what everyone believe is right. I have raised my kids with the meaning of right and wrong, but my youngest daughter got with some bad people where she learned to shop lift, but my disagreement with her think and my disappointment in her made her change her ways.
posted by
Lanetay
on September 5, 2006 at 6:58 PM
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No more questions . I must thank my dear Sunny for being so responsive
and critical in her approach.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:56 PM
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lustorlove, I like to love and respect every one .
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:55 PM
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Any more questions?
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:54 PM
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llustorlove , that is what I was trying to stress that a sinner of one
society could become a saint in another society depending on the choice he makes .
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:54 PM
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afzal50
I am surprised at this statement from you, but thank you for it
posted by
Lanetay
on September 5, 2006 at 6:53 PM
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Sunny , You are absolutely right . Your opinion does make sense.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:52 PM
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sinner
All people are giving the chose to do right or wrong and the type of environment determines how they grow up along with their genes, and physical and mental make up.
posted by
Lanetay
on September 5, 2006 at 6:48 PM
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I don't agree.
People teach their children right from wrong because they have been TOLD that there is right from wrong...instead of just following one's natural instincts.
Let's use nudity for example... Many beliefs are against nudity...so nudity would NOT be considerd moral....but it is moral, and natural....it only becomes immoral when someone puts lies out there that it's filthy and discusting, etc.
I know of many that practice nudity regularly, and it is not something that is frowned upon, or looked at in any negative manner, nor is any thought given to it.
Does this make sense?
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:47 PM
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lustorlove , you are always pure in your thought and feeling and that makes
you a saint in the context of my post and opinion. I respect you .
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:46 PM
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Voltaire , If I am not wrong was a french thinker.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:45 PM
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afzal50
WOW I cant believe you just said that
posted by
Lanetay
on September 5, 2006 at 6:44 PM
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Sunny , I don't think morality is instinctely realised unless some body
teaches you .Are we not taught and do we not teach our children what is right and wrong . If it could come instinctively then there would not have been any need for teaching moral science in schools.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:43 PM
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LOL....Who's Voltaire?
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:43 PM
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That's another good point...different societies have different
standards of what right and wrong is....that just proves what I said.
It's like with animals.....You don't see anyone telling them what is right and what is wrong, and they don't worry for such things. What is right and wrong for them is born into them. It's all natural.
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:43 PM
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Sunny , I agree with you . You remind me of Voltaire that "Even if there is
no God , it is necessary to create one " so is with moral values , it needs to be standardised otherwise people will not have the sense of analysing and differentiating right from wrong . It is true that every society has different set of moral values so how can there be any standard fixed for calling any thing wrong or right but still somethings are universally accepted to be wrong , like no society would accept killing any body right , ofcourse life taken by a judge to avenge murder is another thing.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:39 PM
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afzal
I'm not sure what you're saying, cause I don't believe that is possible.
Define morals. It's like I said. Knowledge of right and wrong comes from inside. Now I'm not saying that people won't be inclined to do wrong....but they will know it is so.
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:34 PM
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lustorlove , plz believe me according to me you are 100% Saint.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:34 PM
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What would happen if the society of the desert developed with people
having no morals.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:31 PM
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Saint
I am a little bit of both but more Saint, in my own mind
posted by
Lanetay
on September 5, 2006 at 6:29 PM
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And what may indecent mean?
It's a word, indecent is part of "sin"....someone tells you something is indecent, but it's not.
Yes, people have a sense of values instinctively.
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:28 PM
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Afzal, sweetie...if someone was born under those circumstances
There would be no such thing as lying and cheating, etc.
For whom would be around to give or receive lies? Or to cheat with?
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:27 PM
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Sunny , So you think that if some one is born in a desert or jungle with
none around he/she would no about moral values instictively. Would he/she know what is a lie, what is indecent , and what is cheating etc.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:25 PM
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CunninLinguist, Thanks for stopping by in two parts.
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:21 PM
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afzal
I don't believe in sin. Sin is something created by religion, something used to "control" people.....
Like if you "sin" this or that bad thing will happen to you. If you don't do this, you're sinning, if you do that you're sinning. It's all about control.
People have built in instincts that tell them right from wrong, without having to be threatend into being slaves of the powerful.
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:10 PM
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I'm part Saint ...part Sinner....
You can say I'm a little bit country and a little bit rock n roll ... Good Post!
Melody
posted by
CunningLinguist
on September 5, 2006 at 6:09 PM
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Why doyou think there is no such thing as a sin in the context of my post .
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 6:05 PM
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afzal
Thanks so much, and Good Morning to you!
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 6:01 PM
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Thanks for watching me closely as you always do . Good evening .
posted by
afzal50
on September 5, 2006 at 5:58 PM
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afzal
Hard for me to say. I don't actually believe in saints. Or sinners for that matter. LOL
posted by
Afzal_Sunny7
on September 5, 2006 at 5:56 PM
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