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- Go to More Muslim Voices on Osama bin Laden’s End…Part III
The summation is the one I took interest because it is true the Lord will not allow an evil person to rule the world so Islam has had its fate sealed long before Bin Ladin! Shelly
posted by
sam444
on May 19, 2011 at 5:55 PM
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it all comes back to one question:
What is to be done about it?
posted by
Ciel
on May 19, 2011 at 2:24 PM
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A little point of etymology about infidel
1460 (adj., n.), from M.Fr. infidèle, from L. infidelis "unfaithful," later "unbelieving," from in- "not" + fidelis "faithful" . In 15c. "a non-Christian" (especially a Saracen); later "one who does not believe in religion" (1526). Also used to translate Arabic kafir, from a root meaning "to disbelieve, to deny," strictly referring to all non-Muslims but virtually synonymous with "Christian;" hence, from a Muslim or Jewish point of view, "a Christian" (1534).
So, strictly speaking, I am a kafir to the Qu'ran and bin Laden was an infidel. That is, I am of the congregation of those who believe on the Lord Jesus Christ while bin Laden, in the military parlance of Muslims, was "in the camp of disbelievers", of those who deny Christ as Christ along withMahomet, the self-styled prophet and Arabic denier of Christ, the denial being the first surahs (chapters) of the Qu'ran. Many Christians speak the same truth to Muslim power and are REALLY martyred.
The etymology of "martyr", from whence "martyred", is also illuminating:
O.E., from L.L., from Gk. martyr, earlier martys (gen. martyros) in Christian use "martyr," lit. "witness," probably related to mermera "care, trouble," from mermairein "be anxious or thoughtful," from PIE *(s)mrtu- (cf. Skt. smarati "remember," L. memor "mindful;" see memory). Adopted directly into most Germanic languages, but O.N. substituted native formation pislarvattr, lit. "torture-witness."
The Christian use stems from St. Stephen, the first martyr, who was stoned because he witnessed the Christ Jesus. Stephen and the Christian martyrs before the Crusades were ALL peacefully preaching the Gospel and died, as their Savior, as "lambs before the slaughter".
The Crusades bring up some relevant history. With the Muslim conquest of the Levant and the persecution of Christian natives and pilgrims in that region, the Byzantine Emperors pleaded repeatedly for help from Europe. Theirs were finally answered, in a way, by Pope Urban, who called for the first Crusade in a curiously Muslim way, promising salvation for its warriors as Mahomet had done in the Qu'ran and urging the taking lands against (who else?) "the infidels":
"All who die by the way, whether by land or by sea, or in battle against the pagans, shall have immediate remission of sins. This I grant them through the power of God with which I am invested. O what a disgrace if such a despised and base race, which worships demons, should conquer a people which has the faith of omnipotent God and is made glorious with the name of Christ! With what reproaches will the Lord overwhelm us if you do not aid those who, with us, profess the Christian religion! Let those who have been accustomed unjustly to wage private warfare against the faithful now go against the infidels and end with victory this war which should have been begun long ago. Let those who for a long time, have been robbers, now become knights. Let those who have been fighting against their brothers and relatives now fight in a proper way against the barbarians. Let those who have been serving as mercenaries for small pay now obtain the eternal reward. Let those who have been wearing themselves out in both body and soul now work for a double honor. Behold! on this side will be the sorrowful and poor, on that, the rich; on this side, the enemies of the Lord, on that, his friends. Let those who go not put off the journey, but rent their lands and collect money for their expenses; and as soon as winter is over and spring comes, let them eagerly set out on the way with God as their guide."
Note, also, the description of Islam as the worship of demons, similar to the "Great Satan" rhetoric of Muslims. Finally, note how the "Crusades" were "holy wars" so that the Muslim complaint is by no means general. If it were, they would have to denounce "jihad" as well. Of course, they won't while Christians will denounce the "Crusades" and pretty much everything in Pope Urban's inflammatory speech. The reason is simple: the "Crusades" were, as a concept, wholely of Muslim origin; they were Pope Urban's Jihad! The Muslim complaint is their not wanting to take their own medicine or, maybe more to the point, copyright enfringement. The Christian complaint, in legal terms which the reverand Jess Jackson might use, is "Libel against the Bible".
posted by
cpklapper
on May 19, 2011 at 1:00 PM
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It's amazing how extensive bin Laden's influence was and continues to be.
posted by
FormerStudentIntern
on May 19, 2011 at 9:35 AM
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I had many friends that died in the towers so as you can deduct, Osama is not one of my favorite topics but I will say one thing... Osama was no Che Guevara... Though I did not agree with his ideology Che Guevara fought for what he believed in and died fighting for it. This character, Osama, killed innocent people with his evil attacks and afterwards, he ran away instead of facing his "enemies" and hid like a cockroach. He was living in his mansion while the young ignorant muslims that idolized him were blowing themselves up and dying fighting the coalition in Afghanistan... the guy might have been a fighter when the Russians had Afghanistan, I don't know about that part of his life... but he had become a megalomaniac, a vane and aging coward. The only thing his death inspires me to say is: good riddance to bad trash , the less we talk about him the better. Be well Naut :-) xoxoxo
posted by
Sinome
on May 18, 2011 at 9:23 PM
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Interesting that "man #4" says that there will always be a good man to fight against an evil man. I might not have said it in exactly the same way, but I like that concept and think perhaps he must be right.
posted by
TAPS.
on May 18, 2011 at 7:47 PM
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No one really takes this ego maniac seriously....didn't stop Hannity
from interviewing him and making points with clueless listeners. Here's some background on the evil Choudary ..
Choudary living large
posted by
VictoriaP
on May 18, 2011 at 6:45 PM
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