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cantey_1975 - I was going to comment but it is better said in a post
posted by
gomedome
on November 1, 2008 at 9:40 AM
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I disagree
There are many of us godless intellectuals who have read the Constitution, and know something about its origins who would argue that the freedoms enshrined there are a break away from the long tyranny of Christianity. You would claim John Locke as a fundamentalist Christian? And Thomas Jefferson? In fact, fundamentalist Christians, by the common definition, do want to impose the Christian religion, under their interpretation, as the law of the land. Those who wish to have the Constitution kept as written join the ACLU and fight for the separation of church and state.
I, for one, don't expect government to take care of humanity. My beliefs do not arise from the Christian tradition or the Christian God, but from humanist principles and a belief that individuals can generally make their own decisions in their own interests. You make generalizations that I suspect most of the world will disagree with, and that do not jibe with history or common definition of your terms. I'd appreciate it if you would quit assigning opinions to me which I do not hold. I'd guess a lot of others feel the same way.
posted by
mousehop
on October 31, 2008 at 7:28 PM
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Re:
you missed the point. Instead, you displayed the typical kneejerk reaction: IGNORANT CHRISTIAN FASCIST!!
And yes I have heard of those things you mentioned, and I understand them. What you fail to realize, is that it is the very belief in the Christian God that motivated those "freedom" clauses.
posted by
calmcantey75
on October 30, 2008 at 3:49 PM
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Where in the US Constitution is God enshrined? Do we both read the same text? Have you heard of the Establishment Clause? Are you aware of the Doctrine of the Separation of Church and State? Are you aware that the Pledge of Allegiance did not mention God until Congress's fairly recent addition? I am a Christian, I was born a Christian; I admire the Christian edict. So please know your facts before you convey factless and incorrect information.
posted by
EX_TURPI
on October 30, 2008 at 3:42 PM
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Re: so where are you going to put the Jews and Muslims and Hindus and Buddhists
I'm not going to put them anywhere. They can practice as they wish, and I never implied otherwise. You completely and probably deliberately missed the point of the post.
posted by
calmcantey75
on October 30, 2008 at 3:42 PM
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Re: This sounds too much like the Jews of old who wanted to overturn the
When you say "legislate morality and force their hands on people", what are you referring to? Does not the "left" attempt to legislate their own version of morality? Legislating morality is unavoidable as long as human beings are doing the legislating. I never advocated "taking control" of the Government to preach the Gospel. I am speaking of an voluntary abandonment of Christian morality in this country.
As long as Christians are members of society, they have a responsibility to be involved in politics.
posted by
calmcantey75
on October 30, 2008 at 3:39 PM
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so where are you going to put the Jews and Muslims and Hindus and Buddhists
and Atheists (and Mormons and Universalists and Humanists and such) in your Christian Nation?
and then what Christian values are you talking about? That of Baptists? Catholics? Prebyterians? Methodists? Episcopalians? Eastern Orthodox? Greek Orthodox? Russian Orthodox? Assemblies of God?
We have varying values among the Christian Denominations.
Odd -- the quotes that have come up here from the Founding Fathers seems to dispute your assertions.
posted by
Xeno-x
on October 30, 2008 at 3:38 PM
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This sounds too much like the Jews of old who wanted to overturn the
Roman government and then they sold Jesus out for 30 pieces of silver to force His hand and take control as "King of the Jews." Instead Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world."
There are many of us Christians who do not believe we need control of the government to preach the Word of God and bring people to Christ. In fact, church and state need to be totally separate in order for the pure Gospel to be preached without the prejudice of "republicans" versus "democrats," "conservatives" versus "liberals." Christians are doing the most damage to reaching lost souls because of their involvement in politics...they are preaching another gospel instead...one of patriotism for a fallen world/government they seek to take control of...wow, very sad.
If Christians would remember the Kingdom of God is eternal and not of this world and that this temporal government on earth is just that, temporal, we might finish the work...but instead, Christians are too busy trying to legislate morality and force their hands on people who do not even believe in God or if they do, have a different concept of God.
I am saddened at the course of the "Christian Right" who have broken the heart of Jesus.
posted by
Ariala
on October 30, 2008 at 3:26 PM
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