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Glennb - I stop short of saying the pope is evil, but I do question his
intentions.
I agree that I am being hard on the pope but not necessarily so towards the Catholic Church itself. Despite acting under the guise of being an international spiritual leader, when the pope comes to a country and begins promoting social norms that don't necessarily jive with either reality, or existing social norms in that country, he is just another interfering foreign national.
The notion of having more kids and petitioning government to help support those kids is simply irresponsible when coming from a person with such influence. There is simply no justifiable reason to promote people having larger families other than to self serve church expansion.
As for organized religion being a necessary evil, to a great extent it is necessary, at least on two fronts. World aid efforts would be crippled without the existence of organized religion and the domestic charitable-social efforts of a great number of organized religions is vitaly important. The negative trade offs are the exclusionary mindset, promoted prejudices and the impediment of scientific research and discovery.
posted by
gomedome
on June 14, 2008 at 10:07 AM
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Gomedome,
You are hard on the Catholic Church! And you have great points of reference, because it has been corrupt for centuries! I have anecdotal evidence that proves a lot of your points (for personal reasons I will not disclose them here)! I did however, discover why my wife was so adamant about my daughter being aware of certain parts of her anatomy.
I do not accept organized religion as a necessary evil. But, it is a convenient tool for evil men! And this Pope is evil!
posted by
Glennb
on June 14, 2008 at 2:13 AM
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sam444 - in fairness to John Paul II, the scandal began long before he
arrived.
It may have in fact been going on for centuries. We can say with some certainty however that there is no possible way that he did not know what was going on. What he is guilty of if nothing else is maintaining the status quo, of doing what they always did. Get the offending priest out of the jurisdiction where he would be prosecuted, never utter a word of warning to anyone where the priest was re-assigned and throw money at all lawsuits in exchange for court ordered silence. Ultimately they worked the laws concerning minors to their advantage in most cases with sealed court records. Subsequently, many of their worst offences have been wiped from the face of history. People can say what they want about how great a man he was but I see it a bit differently, I see a man that put the preservation and expansion of the institution he represented above all else.
posted by
gomedome
on June 13, 2008 at 12:33 PM
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I haven't forgotten the re-assignments! My sons were never allowed to be altar servers per their mother! But I find it so bizarre they promote the family, marriage and yes sire on. John Paul wrote the mystery of lights for the rosary toward the end of his life. I found it to be distressing because it was difficult to believe he could truly understand the institution of marriage without having been a participant. It was simply clinical. But the new pope and his shoe fetish drives me insane. I also adored the references to the clothing. I never really saw them in their garb except for Mass. They were taken off shortly after the priest would celebrate Mass. Side bar, P. John was an outstanding poet though. sam
posted by
sam444
on June 13, 2008 at 11:10 AM
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sam444 - John Paul II got such good PR during his lengthy term that I
wonder to what extent people are capable of blinding themselves to reality.
He was faced with two glaring problems during his term in the decline of subscription to his empire and the growing priest molestation scandal. As he travelled the world to an extent not seen before in the papacy, he was labelled as a spiritual leader reaching out to the poor and downtrodden by making himself available to them. Give me a break, he was acting as any decent sales manager would in building up a declining territory, while doing damage control for an unprecedented scandal. People tend to forget that he maintained the tactics of prosecution evasion by re-assigning priests and playing hardball in court while buying people's silence.
posted by
gomedome
on June 13, 2008 at 10:59 AM
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mysteria - thank you - the spellchecker is a little surprising in the
number of words it doesn't recognize.
But could it be a Falwellian conspiracy? .......hmmm
posted by
gomedome
on June 13, 2008 at 10:50 AM
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myrrhage - I look forward to reading the personal chronicle you describe
I always wondered why people would let a priest counsel marriages? In any other circumstance, having at least a working knowledge of a subject would be a criteria to give advice on that subject.
I noticed the spellchecker has other foibles in words it does not recognize as well, website for example comes back as webster as a suggestion.
posted by
gomedome
on June 13, 2008 at 10:47 AM
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Transcendental Child - "boinking for Jesus" - too funny, I love it
posted by
gomedome
on June 13, 2008 at 10:38 AM
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good thoughts
posted by
Xeno-x
on June 13, 2008 at 10:31 AM
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The only spiritual leader I knew before leaving the Catholic church was John Paul II; I told my sister when he was elected pope that it was going to be a long road with the guy. He just seems to yak! Grand article! sam
posted by
sam444
on June 13, 2008 at 8:29 AM
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Re:
(I also find it amazing that the spellchecker does not recognize the word "homosexuality". Coincidence? I think not!)
Unbelievable enough to be true
posted by
mysteria
on June 13, 2008 at 7:51 AM
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Re: Ahhhh.... a Barren Woman Fighting Crusader! I love it!
Wonderful Absolutely I'm loving the post and the consequent dialogue
That is often the case on this blog Gomedome is a longtime favorite o mine 
No flattery intended Just truth and I'm a truth addict
posted by
mysteria
on June 13, 2008 at 7:49 AM
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Here's an interesting story I will soon be posting some long-overdue blogs about:
Upon learning of my father's homosexuality, which she had suspected for some time, my mother suggested that perhaps marriage counseling would point the two of them in the right direction. Lucky for me, the only affordable (read:free) option to them at that time was to visit their priest for advice. His counsel? Have a child! Yes, a child would save their marriage!
Three years later, they divorced, and here I still be. Ironically, I am an only child, as my mother was never able to conceive again.
I wouldn't reveal so much if I didn't intend to write about this in detail. The problem with organized religion isn't so different from the perils of organized government. It's the blind leading the disenfranchised.
(I also find it amazing that the spellchecker does not recognize the word "homosexuality". Coincidence? I think not!)
posted by
myrrhage
on June 13, 2008 at 7:46 AM
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Ahhhh.... a Barren Woman Fighting Crusader! I love it!
I wonder if the idiots ever pause to consider that the number of priests and nuns they have serving a vow of chastity has anything to do with low birth rates. They should be boinking for Jesus... that would certainly get the numbers up... and cut down on the number of child molestations in the meantime (hopefully).
posted by
Transcendental_Child
on June 13, 2008 at 7:35 AM
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