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Re: Re: if you look at the people who are ordained

RedStatesMan:

Let me say right here that I am a VERY faithful Christian woman. I've been reading Kooka since I signed onto Blogit, and I've NEVER found Kooka (or Gomedome for that matter) to attack or mock religion. Their issues are with those believers themselves that display obvious hypocrisy and can't accept that they have free will, and are exercising it.

I have, however, noticed that somehow, people seem to naturally lump Kooka and Gomedome together as if they are one brain. I have been reading them both, and let me tell you, if you stop getting defensive and try to view where they each are coming from (which, by the way are different places, since they are different people--a fact that seems to elude many people that just love to lump Kooka and Gomedome together) you might learn something.

posted by FineYoungSinger on January 30, 2008 at 12:49 PM | link to this | reply

Re: FineYoung

Kooka---this is exactly why I read you. I totally agree with this statement.

I know lots of "ministers" that just don't have the right disposition to offer guidence. They are great at banging the bible on your head, but can't explain how it's relevant in any way. Keep writing....great stuff.

posted by FineYoungSinger on January 30, 2008 at 12:43 PM | link to this | reply

RSM

That comment made no sense at all in the least.

First off, read my posts here and show me where I daily mock religion and God.

Second, what does the government doing what is it suppose to be doing, which is having nothing to do with religion, have anything to do with what me and other's here write about?

Seriously man, do you ever have any idea what you are talking about? It really seems that you are greatly confused for the most part. You are more concerned with trying to make me look bad when I express my views than you are of making any sense at all with what you say.

posted by kooka_lives on January 26, 2008 at 8:46 AM | link to this | reply

Re: if you look at the people who are ordained

"government backs away from religious matters on logical grounds -- the freedom of religion as noted in our Constitution.

if gov't recognizes it, then it is legit"

Well then, why the daily attacks and mockery on religion and God by you, kooka and gomedome?

posted by RedStatesMan on January 25, 2008 at 9:02 PM | link to this | reply

looks like you can even give absolution of sins

posted by Xeno-x on January 24, 2008 at 1:04 PM | link to this | reply

if you look at the people who are ordained

they advertise performing ceremonies and lots of minister-related things.

i don't see where governments reject this.

many organizations without the usual accreditation have sent ministers out -- and they have been accepted. the church I once belonged to being one example.

government backs away from religious matters on logical grounds -- the freedom of religion as noted in our Constitution.

if gov't recognizes it, then it is legit

posted by Xeno-x on January 24, 2008 at 12:58 PM | link to this | reply

FreeMan

The initial reason as to why I got ordained was more or less to prove a point about titles in general. In truth I do not take my ordainment seriously as do none of my friends who are also ordained through the ULC (Many of them worked for a physic hotline and in order to give spiritual advice you had to be ordained and the easiest way to do that was with a ULC ordainment. Yes, physic hotlines official give spiritual advice by law). But that will not stop me from using it to prove my points and doing weddings and such with it. I am causing no harm and breaking no laws. I have pointed out that I feel the ULC mostly is about making money( As are a great many churches out there now days, even the more 'officially' recognized ones), and all one needs to do is check out heir website to see this.

No matter what though, I am a legally ordained Minster and have all the right and privileges there of. The opinions on how legitimate the church itself is really does not matter in this case. If those like RedStates there do not wish to view me as a minister, I really don't care, since I put no faith in the ministers of their or any religion really. The law says I am a minister, so if I so choose to use that title at times I get to.

posted by kooka_lives on January 24, 2008 at 12:43 PM | link to this | reply

kooka - I went to the link. I had a friend in high school get ordained

through these people back when it was done through the mail. My question about all this is how are people ordained to minister a belief when they believe everything? Thats why I stopped going to the Unitarian Universalist Church. They were wishy washy, accepting but drawing no defining lines.

I think there should be some sort of proving ground before anyone can be ordained. It seems pretty worthless otherwise. Unless its just a joke. Which I imagine the ULC really is.

posted by FreeManWalking on January 24, 2008 at 12:27 PM | link to this | reply

FineYoung

Even with some of the in depth formal training the churches give those they give out titles to, very often that training is really almost counter productive to the greater idea of ministering if you ask me. It often makes them more closed minded and more focused on pushing very limited ideas based solely on one group's faith. I have met many well 'educated' ministers who are piss poor in their guidance skills and show a true lack of being able to really do anything more than preach and spit out what they were taught to preach and spit out.

For me a true guide of religious ideas needs to be open minded and able to guide other's from a position of understating and a sense of getting the big picture above just being able to recite words from a book.

posted by kooka_lives on January 24, 2008 at 12:23 PM | link to this | reply

cantey

It seems you got the point of what I was saying.

Thank you.

posted by kooka_lives on January 24, 2008 at 12:17 PM | link to this | reply

RSM, you still have no idea what you are saying

The ULC has as much credentials as a church as any church does, so their ministers are just as official ministers as any other church out there. You CANNOT accredit a church in regards to the officialness of those they choose to ordain.

They are not credited educationally and so any DEGREES they give out are not accredited.

Being a ordained by them and getting a degree through them are two very separate things.

You really seem to be very mixed up on it all here. Either you don't understand the difference between a degree and an ordainment, or you are just trying so hard to discredit me that you are willing to ignore the facts and pretend what you say makes sense.

Since I got my ordainment from a church, that is all the credentials I need to be a minister according to our laws. Somehow your views do not get to over rule the actual laws.

As for YOUR OPINION bothering me, it doesn't at all. I wrote this blog just to put the whole issue right out here for all to see and let everyone give their two cents worth. You are not the first one to come out and try to discredit me or be upset over the fact that I legally am an ordained minister. All you did was inspire me to write a post about it.

posted by kooka_lives on January 24, 2008 at 12:14 PM | link to this | reply

Re: Great Post, Kooka.

I feel the same way about a church who has ordained Bubba as a minister simply because he has been there the longest and was there everytime the church door was open. The more it is dumbed down the cheaper the title gets until it is meaningless. I can not imagine presenting myself in a job interview as a college graduate if my education came from an non-accredited school.

posted by RedStatesMan on January 24, 2008 at 10:41 AM | link to this | reply

Great Post, Kooka.

With all the "Christian" ministers/pastors that have simply hung up a shingle with little or no formal training (and exactly the same amount of knowledge and ability in many of these cases)....

posted by FineYoungSinger on January 24, 2008 at 6:57 AM | link to this | reply

and

a man who is a husband and father is, in my opinion, if he is doing his duty, a minister. Nothing wrong with being recognized for it.

posted by calmcantey75 on January 24, 2008 at 1:29 AM | link to this | reply

definition of the term minister

curate: a person authorized to conduct religious worship; "clergymen are usually called ministers in Protestant churches"

a person appointed to a high office in the government; "Minister of Finance"

a diplomat representing one government to another; ranks below ambassador

attend to the wants and needs of others; "I have to minister to my mother all the time"

work as a minister; "She is ministering in an old parish"

the job of a head of a government department
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/minister

1) The word ‘minister’ is from the Latin and means ‘servant’. It usually applies to the person conducting a service be they lay or ordained. ... www.easterncathedrals.org.uk/glossary/retrieve.php

I guess anyone who meets one or more of these is technically a minister

anyone can be ordained a "minister" of any faith they happen to adhere to.

posted by calmcantey75 on January 24, 2008 at 1:04 AM | link to this | reply

Tell The Whole Story

from the ULC website:

"After you fill out the free ordination form, you will receive a pop-up instant ordination credential, which serves as your receipt of your free ordination."

In other words, if you can type in your name and address then eureka you are a minister! However, this is what you did not mention in your blog. I stated that the degree does not come from an accredited source and this is stated on the ULC website:

9. Are the courses accredited? The ULC Seminary is not accredited by any agency nor are we currently seeking national or regional accreditation. Most Department of Education recognized National Institutional and Specialized Accrediting Bodies are linked to mainstream Christian and Jewish faiths and their accreditation requirements would severely limit the breadth and variety of course offered by the Seminary on a plethora of religious paths.

This is like receiving a drivers license from K-Mart. If you are willing to present yourself as a minister then you must have credentials and this does not qualify as having credentials. That is what I stated before and you did not include all of my reasons then again I did not expect anything different. This is all that I pointed out in my previous reply but I did notice that it did bother you enough to create a blog to defend yourself.