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Presley - that is a sad example of young people needing attention
With the suicide outcomes a testament to that need. When I envision what you describe it does however garner a chuckle in how young people deal with high school. The social misfits get together, form a covent and play the role daily to hold a fear derived power over their peers. If not for the tragic outcomes, it would be hilarious.
posted by
gomedome
on January 19, 2007 at 9:27 AM
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Gomedome
The vodoo you mentioned reminded me of some girls I used to know. I went to highschool with a bunch of girls who claimed to be
Black Witches, whatever that was supposed to mean. They used to get together and attempt to cast spells on fellow students. They always wore black and one was never without another. They had a large part of the school population afraid of them; afraid of pissing them off or provoking them. I thought it was silly and clearly remember verbally taking 4 of them on while they sat in a car and shouted hateful comments in my direction. It was just a bunch of immature, emotionally unstable girls in desperate need of attention. Anyways, one of them committed suicide during my senior year - shotgun blast to the head. Another one of them killed herself during the summer after we graduated - pills and liquor. Kharma? Maybe!
posted by
Presley
on January 19, 2007 at 7:06 AM
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Nautikos - I agree - reactions to curses are derived entirely from the
subject's expectations.
You have explained it very well in your comment and have also hit on what I "believe" is the key to the spiritual realm in general. When it is suggested that all manifestations, paranormal experiences or so called contact with the spirit world are derived from within the human mind, I tend to support that notion. Admittedly it only fills in some of the blanks of our pourus knowledge in these areas but the "placebo effect" and other similar consistent human reactions should indicate the validity of this line of reasoning.
posted by
gomedome
on January 19, 2007 at 6:53 AM
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gome
As always, well argued.
Of course voodoo is 'nonsense'. In spite of that, it can be effective, and its very effectiveness is tied to ignorance.
We know of the placebo effect. There is a large body of research which demonstrates clearly that the placebo effect is real. At the very least, the recipient of the placebo, believing it to be 'real' medication, will often experience a reduction in stress, which can have various positive results.
In voodoo, the same principle is used in reverse. If the recipient believes the curse to be 'real', it increases stress and can lead to a variety of other results. Again, there is plenty of evidence for that.
And I, by the way, do not believe (there's that word again, lol) that in 'this modern day and age', just because we call it that, human superstitions and 'general ignorance' will decrease. 
posted by
Nautikos
on January 19, 2007 at 6:26 AM
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its good to see this blog active
its a good cataylst
posted by
calmcantey75
on January 18, 2007 at 4:53 PM
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Xeno-x - if you are saying what goes around comes around, I can agree with
that.
Wishing ill upon others to a point where a person attempts to cause it is simply the product of an unhealthy mind. Despite the fact that curses and the like are just dribbling nonsense, there is no doubt about the indvidual's intent.
posted by
gomedome
on January 18, 2007 at 4:24 PM
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problem though with those curses
what you send out comes back to you.
so they received equal measure what they wished for you
posted by
Xeno-x
on January 18, 2007 at 2:25 PM
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arGee - there is proof of what you say posted on this site every day
(as well as all other public forums)
The root causes for this modern day dilemma has numerous influences and it truly is a dilemma. Our free societies have allowed the introduction and consideration of countless bogus "theories" and channels of thought. To a point where, as you say, our younger generations cannot discern the valid from the invalid. A recent poll asked students graduating from high school to outline what constitutes a scientific theory. About 15% where able to answer the question. How is this possible in the 21st century? How bad is it in other parts of the world where education is not up to our standards?
Typically we see words that have specific scientific meanings adopted as common vernacular, which in effect alters their meanings. Words such as: theory or evolve, to use but two examples. Where those of us not of scientific disciplines are probably all guilty of this to some degree, there are an alarming number of educated people that think the colloquial use of these words is their true meaning. My point is that somewhere along the way and due to factors too numerous to identify, our societies have slipped into a coma of sorts. We not only have produced succeeding generations of inept thinkers, we have people creating self serving agendas utilizing this ineptness as the springboard.
posted by
gomedome
on January 18, 2007 at 8:51 AM
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I am currently posting, Gome...
Extracts from "Reading, ’Riting, and ’Rithmetic, Taught to the Tune of...," the chapter on education in my book, The Chicken Little Agenda. The primary problem in U.S. schools is that our children are no longer taught to think. They grow up believing that every idea is as good as every other idea, and never learn to distinguish between opinion and fact. They are incapable of genuinely logical thinking.
All this leads to a casual acceptance of "new age" concepts as the equal of what science has taught us. They see the mumbo jumbo of an incantation as only a variation on the proof of an isosceles triangle, an astrological forecast number string as the equivalent of an astrophysical equation. And why shouldn't they? Their teachers do...
posted by
arGee
on January 18, 2007 at 7:40 AM
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arGee - when I searched a line from one of the curses, I was surprised at
the size of the industry associated with these things.
I've never paid much attention to this stuff, no one in my world gives black magic and such things any credence. (nor do I have much interest) Astrology and similar things on the other hand have permeated our society but on many levels. I think it is safe to say that people who subscribe to those things do so from widely varying positions of belief in their validity. For most folks it is a form of entertainment or pastime. But there are some folks who think that these things are valid and will never realize that they have created that validity by their own expectations and selective reasoning.
posted by
gomedome
on January 18, 2007 at 7:14 AM
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cantey_1975 - Where nothing people do shocks me any more, this
tincident surprised me for when it happened.
Mind you, I cannot say if it was someone from this category, my tracking cannot tell me that. But I am fairly certain that it was one of my antagonists from this blog. If anything it underlines what we all are dealing with when we post in a public forum.
posted by
gomedome
on January 18, 2007 at 7:05 AM
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mysteria - I wonder how modern societies with all of our advancements
and access to education produce these people.
These old superstitions only exist because there are people that willfully proliferate these things.
posted by
gomedome
on January 18, 2007 at 7:01 AM
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People cast spells and toss curses, Gome...
For the same reasons they visit astrologers and buy pyramids. Since the dawn of the "computer age," astrology has flourished like never before, because astrologers are now able to refine their charts, using special programs to determine the exact position of not only the planets at a person's birth, but their various moons, the known comets, and even the state of visible variable stars. Clearly, such detailed information gives them significantly more insight into a person's state at birth.
I have known several such people, and they are completely convinced about their "science." Joannie, who specializes in numerology, was enthralled with our (close) friendship. At one point she told me with a glowing face how wonderful it was that we had so much in common – I was an engineer and she was a numerologist (numbers, you see). This girl was a Trekkie's Trekkie, having memorized nearly all the dialog in the entire original Star Trek series, and yet she was incapable of distinguishing between science and pseudo-science.
For every person like you and me, Gome, there are a thousand Joannies. I promise you that as soon as civilians are able to migrate to the Moon and to Mars and settle there, one of the first entrepreneurial business will be a palm reading or astrology shop; and they will do well.
Go figure...
posted by
arGee
on January 18, 2007 at 7:00 AM
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at least you get a rise out of folks
seriously, I think a lot of the acrimony you get is born of jealousy. A crippled, lame spirit will always attack a healthy one especially when that spirit has always been a crippled one, and that healthy one has always been healthy.
But the curses themselves are of course phony as far as them harming you. If they harm anyone at all it would be the issuers.
posted by
calmcantey75
on January 17, 2007 at 8:31 PM
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Gome
The world is cursed with an overriding preponderance of ignorance. It seems that for every freethinking individual there are at least a hundred that are caught in the mix of superstitious lunacy.
posted by
mysteria
on January 17, 2007 at 8:30 PM
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