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My point, dear Corbin and I did have one: Your sources are suspect.
I hope you've started breathing again. Before you start your usual tirade about tangents, let me point out that you never responded to my question. I will keep it short and simple, since you can't follow my logic: Your source, the Detroit Free Press has been outed as a Union-busting rag by REPUTABLE news agencies, the Columbia Journalism Review, the National Labor Review Board. Do you read this stuff, or just cut and paste?
Please, I read your comment on Blogflogger's post. You don't need to ""spare"" me, just answer facts with facts.
posted by
Blanche.
on February 15, 2006 at 7:11 PM
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CD
And you have done it VERY WELL!! Good to see you back!
posted by
Offy
on February 14, 2006 at 4:05 PM
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Offy
I'm kind of like.....counting to 10.....do you know what I mean? If I don't, I would be really blasting someone right now and I'm trying not to lower myself to their level..........
9
8
7...........
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 14, 2006 at 4:03 PM
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CD
Where ever you are, I hope you will be back soon!!! You are missed!!
posted by
Offy
on February 14, 2006 at 3:07 PM
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not much of an argument here
this is part of the past when unions were powwerful and automakers made scads of dough -- and hardly anybody in the world made cars except detroit.
yes the world is changing
but not
don't get hot under the collar at unions.
they're just like the rest of us -- they want all that $$$$$.
if you can get it why not huh?
i think unions should be universal -- then everybodywould get a fairer deal
we just don't need the explitation of circumstances that you describe.
surprised that I'm so agreeable?
posted by
Xeno-x
on February 13, 2006 at 3:49 PM
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Do you deserve the title of your blog?
OK, I'll explain in itty-bitty words so that you can't misunderstand, intentionally or not.
Guckert/Gannon was a plant, put there to make the administration look good.
I posit that "Ken Pool" is a "plant". He is quoted in two different articles, one as a loafing union guy, and another commenting on management. If he was goofing off at a jobs bank, how is it that 10 days later he's working at the truck plant? I questioned the credibility of your source. Your only source, by the way. How is that not relevant?
It is not my opinion that the Detroit News is biased; it is the opinion of the NLRB, Columbia Journalism Review & the Harvard Crimson.
You completely ignored a reasonable alternative to Ford's woes, a bloated & overpaid management.
Face it dude, I trashed you with research, reasoning & logic. And you come back with "you're on a tangent". Weak. Address the issues. Don't fall back on your tired old cliches about tangents & opinions. You've used it before. It's not the case here. Or else you're going to have to change your blog name to If I get SMART, how will I know?
posted by
Blanche.
on February 13, 2006 at 11:25 AM
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1st, to explain the Guckert/Gannon comment. Guckert was a male prostitute who also was in the White House Press Corps under the name Jeff Gannon. (tangent)
And that has something to do with this post and story? How?
That would make it a tangent..........
You seem to do that very well around here......(opinion)
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 13, 2006 at 6:13 AM
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Google is very effective.....
It's how someone uses it that brings that effectiveness to a grinding halt......(an opinion)
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 13, 2006 at 6:09 AM
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Blanche
Thank you so much for again giving us a striking example of your opinion.......
and an unrelated tangent or two.....LOL
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 13, 2006 at 6:07 AM
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Hoodwinked?
1st, to explain the Guckert/Gannon comment. Guckert was a male prostitute who also was in the White House Press Corps under the name Jeff Gannon.
"Ken Pool" was quoted in the article you lifted from The Detroit News. "We go in and play crossword puzzles..." etc., etc ( Detroit News, October 17th, 2005.)
The same Ken Pool was quoted 10 days later, commenting on management's crackdown on excessive potty breaks "(Managers) always go after the small stuff when times get tough, because they don't have control over the big stuff, either," said Ken Pool, an hourly worker at Michigan Truck." (emphasis added).
So how is it that this Pool guy is lounging about, doing the crossword, watching videos at some luxurious Jobs Bank on the 17th, and working at the same Truck plant he was laid off from on the 27th? Seems like you wouldn't want to give up a cush lifestyle like that. Is he a plant? A faked news source? Lying or made up? It smells pretty fishy. Brings into question the rest of the story. (See how effective Google is?)
The rest of the story...
The Detroit News is biased against unions. Period. The Nat'l Labor Relations Board upheld a charge of unfair labor practices. (FAIR, www.ppw.org) Not only did they run slanted stories about their own union troubles, they actually ran false stories. Reporters asked to have their bylines removed from stories (when does THAT ever happen) after management edited their stories to reflect a more pro-management line (Harvard Crimson 7/7/00).
The Columbia Journalism Review (11/12/95) called the News & Free Press coverage of their own labor dispute "strikingly tilted", a charge Giles (former editor & publisher) didn't even deny, claiming that the press had to "balance the story" since "the unions, in our judgement, really have a sort of platform to present their positions without any meaningful challenge," (Editor & Publisher, 3/96)
I smell a "rat". A fishy source from a paper with a history of union-busting, slanted to make the unions look bad. I'm sure there is LOTS more to this story than The Detroit News has presented.
Oh, if you want to know what's really driving up the price of American cars, look at CEO Bill Ford's compensation package: non-salary renumeration (he doesn't take a salary) of $22,000,000 a year!!! That breaks down to about $10,500 per hour!!! Makes these poor crossword puzzle geeks look like paupers. (BTW, the average Japanese auto executive earns $1.2 million a year, and that is based on performance)
posted by
Blanche.
on February 12, 2006 at 9:28 PM
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Corbin,
Just passing through to get my daily bit of information...I guess I'm completely out of the loop, I had no idea something like this was going on. It's simply amazing what one can learn from people like you!
posted by
ms_bradrock
on February 12, 2006 at 7:09 PM
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Thank you for your opinion.....
and that is a fact........
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 12, 2006 at 6:36 PM
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CORBIN
My son and I were talking about this very issue last week. I told him I didn't think we would ever get that kind of a job, just not our luck. He said to me he wouldn't want it anyway. Sad state of affairs these days. It can not sustain for a long duration, although I am surprised it has gone on for over 12 years! Good post as usual my friend!!!
posted by
Offy
on February 12, 2006 at 6:28 PM
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Dude, you are too funny yourself
Try to keep up: Ford is or was a US based corporation, functioning and existing inside the good ol' US of A, utiliziing US resources: highway (can't have cars when there's nothing to drive on), a highly trained and educated labor pool (must need technical training of some sort, provided for at taxpayer's expense), and labor laws protecting highly trained laborers.
When Ford started downsizing, they promised the unions that there would be resources for those downsized workers to utilize so they wouldn't have to take a Burger King job: eg, an auto assembly mechanic, or some other skilled laborer. They also promised job banks, to help retrain those workers. Ford is merely keeping up their end of the conctract, of which there used to be one between corporations and US labor.
Ford has an obligation to its workers, to thsi country which provided it the infrastructure to obtain its wealth and provided the income for many people to be able to buy their cars to provide them some resources. They didn't get that rich in a vacuum. It's called social responsiblity. God bless America, this is not Hong Kong (yet).
posted by
Blanche.
on February 12, 2006 at 6:26 PM
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Uhhh Blanche......
Inquiring minds want to know. After all, you have a duty to your reading public not to say, present fiction as facts.
How do you stay on topic long enough to recognize one........you are a trip! ROTFLMAO!
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 12, 2006 at 6:20 PM
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Uhhhhhh...check your eyeglass scrip, Blanche
The Detroit News is one of the two major newspapers in Detroit....been there since 1873. Founded by the Scripps family.....
Perhaps if you looked a bit closer...you would have noticed that the Auto Insider is a section of the newspaer with articles regarding the Auto industry...you know thy make a lot of cars in the Detroit area......
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 12, 2006 at 6:15 PM
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Not Hall Monitor, Corbin: Jello Sheriff. Huge Difference.
BTW, yes, I googled it and I checked another source besides the Auto Trader, or whatever the auto industry trade maganzine is called. (Biased? Perhaps). What springs to mind is why is Ken Pool quoted for the original article on 10/17 as saying that he was playing solitaire for $31 an hour and again on 10/22 as saying that Ford managers check their employees bathroom break time.
What was the name of the gay escort in the White House press pool? Gukkin? Gupton? The one who lobs softball questions for Scotty, the press secretary? Why be peevish about asking for sources, you're writing in News & Politics, after all. Inquiring minds want to know. After all, you have a duty to your reading public not to say, present fiction as facts.
BTW, I do hope you're recovering nicely from your flu. I mean that sincerely. It is no fun.
posted by
Blanche.
on February 12, 2006 at 6:05 PM
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Hmmmmm?
Does that mean the the Auto Companies can't write their wages off a s a charitable contribution?????
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 12, 2006 at 5:06 PM
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Janes...
The article went on to say that they were organizing volunters to work ar food banks and community centers........from the people sitting around.
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 12, 2006 at 5:05 PM
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That is gross!
I wonder if the UAW bosses can comprehend that if the Big Three continue to swirl the drain, the UAW shares a huge responsibility for their demise and/or significant weakening. I'm all for these companies declaring bankruptcy and restructuring to get rid of the UAW.
And before any wailing liberal berates me for my "hard hearted" conservativism, I should say that I am in favor of all CEOs and board members slashing their pay by 50%. As well, I am for the union/blue collar types to make a very decent living. $20-30/hr is appropriate assuming they're actually DOING the work, and not doing cross word puzzles. As well, pensions will have to be a thing of the past. Forget those, move on, get over the pension concept and accept a 401k.
posted by
JanesOpinion
on February 12, 2006 at 4:59 PM
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Blanche....
You are too funny......have you ever used Google? If you type in "Job Bank Program" the first article that comes up is by the Detroit News....
Now you know I always try and make sure I have links to what I post.....but I guess I still not up to par yet....
So Blanche....this link's for you:
http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0510/17/A01-351179.htm
BTW....Have you been appointed "Hall Monitor"?????
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on February 12, 2006 at 4:53 PM
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Great post Corbin!
These unions and workers wonder why they can't compete and here is a very good reason.
I think Blanche might be questioning your integrity just a bit!
posted by
sarooster
on February 12, 2006 at 3:09 PM
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Sources?
Interesting story, if true. Where did you get it? I'd like to check the original source to get context.
posted by
Blanche.
on February 12, 2006 at 1:07 PM
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your news
is as equally upsetting to me as when i found out that companies use prisoners as a cheap labour source to do telemarketing. (think it was on 60 minutes) they're calling people's homes, selling them products, getting charge card numbers, addresses, etc.
where's the reward for living your life well? you can't get a job because it's been outsourced to cheap labor.
whatever happened to working for a living and having something to show for your efforts. i can appreciate that some people aren't going to walk away from an opportunity to earn mad money doing nothing but at the end of the day, where is their contribution to society?
posted by
fourcats
on February 12, 2006 at 12:54 PM
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