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- Go to AFTER READING MANY CHRISTIANS HERE ON BLOGIT, I'VE COME TO A CONCLUSION
Gee, I see I've made a list
and it's not a popular list to be on.
But because I have very strong moral values, and because I respect the Word of God and because I voted Republican, my name and everything I stand for has been smeared through the mud of people who say they're tolerant but are actually intolerant of anyone who takes a stand for strong values.
I do believe that the anonymity of the Internet makes it easier for me to verbalize strong opinions and comments I might later regret. I don't have to face these people the next day at work, so I speak my mind freely, later realizing that what I said was definitely not "turn the cheek Christ-like." However, at the same time, there is so much ranting and raving going on against ANYTHING Christian, that the last thing on my mind is rolling over, being a wall flower and letting people traipse all over my beliefs.
I have been impressed (and dismayed) to see how it is so acceptable to verbalize extraordinary negativity towards Christians (specifically those with a backbone), but it is profoundly NOT politically/religiously correct to say anything negative about anyone else -- gays, Muslims or ANY other religion except perhaps Jewish, pornographers, left wingers, etc.
If I could do it differently, there've been times when I wish I had been more loving. You folk who are the usual recipients of my anger do not KNOW me. The real me. You only see the tirant who "yells" out of frustration because of the constant hate and intolerance against everything I hold dear.
So for now, since I'm in the minority here on Blogit, there's a very good chance I shall continue to rant and rave. Consider yourself warned. 
posted by
JanesOpinion
on October 10, 2005 at 7:09 PM
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xeno-X--
I think you need a hug.
Hemlocker
posted by
Hemlocker
on October 10, 2005 at 5:47 PM
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May I add . . . .
That it is primarily Christian Fundamentalists who are so demon-like. Yes, they are in cahoots with their Satan in ther hate of all who are unlike them. I cover this, by the way, in one of my blogs. Fundamental Christians are like fundamentalists in any religion, and all religions are cursed by fundamentalists who believe theirs is the only way and that all others are doomed to the wrath of their god, whether it be Jehova, Christ, Allah or Krishna.
Mainstream Christians are nothing like their fundamentalist counterparts, but the fundamentalists are louder and more attention seeking. They only appear to be more numerous because of their obnoxious, un-Chrisitian behavior. How to handle them? Easy. Listen politely; state your opinion of their ideas (no personal attacks!) and move on away from them, allowing them to scream and simmer, being their old, ineffective shadows of Christian faith that they are.
posted by
archiew
on October 9, 2005 at 6:52 AM
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ok calebs-blogger
you're on the list
i've got to read you, however, which I promise to do (maybe I have already - I think so) and assess how you compare to these others.
posted by
Xeno-x
on October 7, 2005 at 8:56 AM
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Xeno-x
I remember that amendment real well, because me and my 'born again' friend had some debates over it. It was the first election both of us could vote in. He very much misunderstood the idea behind it. He was trying to say that the homosexuals were trying for minority status at that the amendment would make it so they could not get it. I kept trying to explain to him that the amendment went well beyond out that and would allow for them to be openly discriminated against. Basically the main reason it passed was because the voters were being given bad information on it and those who were for the amendment were able to spread some serious lies about just what was going on. For there was never a movement out here for the homosexuals to get minority status. I was very glad when it got declared unconstitutional.
The real problem is ignorance. Those who really hold a level of hate and fear towards homosexuals wish to spread propaganda making them out to be some kind of evil, immoral group. The whole thing seems very anti-Christians to me, but it is mostly the Christians who are pushing it.
posted by
kooka_lives
on October 6, 2005 at 7:06 PM
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Dare I ask?
After reading the string of comments on this post, I must admit I almost left without commenting. But, I shall try to be fearless and transparent.
For a moment, I tired to decide whether - as an overtly Christian blogger - I hoped I'd find my blog on your list... or whether I'd like it better if I wasn't on the list. (I wasn't).
Maybe my vanity wanted to know I'd been read and noticed... and being noticed for any reason was better than being ignored. But then again, I was kind of glad I wan't on your list as I don't think I've devoted too much blog time to the politically charged and divisive topics you mention. (I only remember 2 on homosexuality, one on abortion, and one on the Supreme Court since June.)
But then again, if I'm not making a big enough stir to make the list - does that mean I'm not particularly good at getting my message out? After all, grace is pretty radical.
Maybe I'm simply jealous for the clicks as I've never had 21 comments on anything I've ever posted. (What is my record? 12?) Who knows but if that's the reason.. shame on me.
I think after all this mental back and forth I have decided I am glad I wasn't on your list. I think I'd really prefer some kind of agree-to-disagree, worthy opposition-like status. However, if I have to settle for obscurity... that's ok. I'm having fun. And I reached a minor milestone - I cleared 1000 page views today... so at least a few people are reading... on or off the list. 
But ... you are certainly welcome to visit my blog and send a few clicks my way anytime.
posted by
calebs_blogger
on October 5, 2005 at 7:46 PM
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Xeno-x -- that's where my knowledge is a bit lacking. The US administrative
system is only the same as Canada on the surface with the 3 distinct levels of federal, provincial (state) and municipal.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 2:45 PM
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well that was Colorado
passing a state constitutional amendment that only could have come from bias -- that prohibits local political entities from passing laws to protect gays from discrimination.
It's hard to conceive that 21st Century people would vote for such a law -- especially a majority of that state. There had to be a special campaign to get out the vote for the amendment, I would say.
But the U.S. Supreme Court struck the law down and rightfully so. They saw the discrimination and bias and unconstitutionality of the law.
this is an example of what can happen.
MIssouri is also of such a mind to pass similar laws.
It may not be the national scale that we should be afraid of -- but on a local level -- states in particular -- and now that states' rights are reborn . . .
posted by
Xeno-x
on October 5, 2005 at 2:39 PM
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Xeno-x - that's the point
For example: I could easily envision a leader holding much the same beliefs as your current president but with a bit more polish and finesse running roughshod over the rights of a number of minorities. In an atmosphere of fear, disappointment and economic hardship, imaginary enemies are found in a hurry. If the developing and currently existing attitudes as we have witnessed right here on Blogit are any indication.....all gays, non believers, persons of other faiths but especially Moslems and others should hope there is no dramatic economic downturn. There is a lot more to this but too lengthy for a comment.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 2:30 PM
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clarify?
many attitudes today parallel attitudes of Hitler's Germany. What give one pause is that someone could exploit these attitudes, like Hitler did, maybe not with the same results -- but still . . .
posted by
Xeno-x
on October 5, 2005 at 2:21 PM
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Xeno-x -- there is no doubt that many of the sentiments were instilled or
inherent for centuries, with a nurturing or propigating influence manifesting them into full blown prevailing attitudes, hence the parallel I've tried to draw. In the case of pre WW2 Germany, a number of factors coalesced together, including economic need, an anger hangover from WW1 and an enigmatic leader able to combine it all to further his own ends. The enemies were both real and imagined. We are looking at a lot of these same parameters today.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 2:16 PM
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CB_Andrews -- no you never have been guilty of pushing your beliefs on
others: "I realize you said you have no precepts of your own, but if you were leaning toward secular humanism, you might want to re-think it."
Actually this is also a good example of you not getting it as well because the first half of the sentence misrepresents what I had actually said. An hour after making my aquaintance, you are suggesting that I re-think my beliefs......too funny. Then there were offers of "help", that was funny too but of course you never did any of these things.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 2:06 PM
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gome
thanks for once again proving my point. I charge headlong into my beliefs because they are generally a way someone backs up statements like "i am against abortion" etc...i do not live in a fantasy world or try to peddle my magic on anyone, i simply involve christianity in my posts with you because you so arrogantly are trying to piss off Bible thumpers...as your blog says. Maybe you should read my posts, you'd get a little incentive and enlightenment to talk to me on some normal plain. Gomedome, once again,you never cease to amaze me with the lack of understanding and openess you claim that no one else has. It's time to start practicing what you preach my friend.
posted by
CB_Andrews
on October 5, 2005 at 1:52 PM
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the medieval church's
attitude toward Jews
gave rise to Hitler's anti-semitism
once the Church came into power, there were quite a few slaughters of "heretical" groups.
posted by
Xeno-x
on October 5, 2005 at 1:48 PM
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CB_Andrews -- Nice try, but your beliefs are a shroud on any intelligence
you may have, I wouldn't know how intelligent you are because the very first words you greet people with are that you are a Christian, followed by a headlong charge into YOUR beliefs. From me you will always get a figurative cuff in the head for trying to impose such inferior beliefs upon me. Whether you can grasp it or not, the 30 years that I have proceeded you onto this planet has forced some experience and knowledge upon me that you do not have. For example: I've seen countless God fan club members such as yourself, come off of the production line to be as insufferable as you are, only to temper and develop their own beliefs over the years. Learn to observe realities. I have not once commented on your postings because I am happy to let you live your delusion, be my guest, knock yourself out discussing fantasy as if it is factual. Turn a blind eye to the problems that your religion is causing in the world today, I could not care less, but the minute you try to engage me in supporting your delusion, you can count on being slapped about for insulting my intelligence. You have a choice here. You can keep coming back to get slapped in the head again, or you can simply go away and bother someone else. There are lots of people on this site that will be happy to indulge you. I just happen to not be one of them.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 1:43 PM
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Gomedome...
I'm afraid to say this, but I think you've "lost" another one.
You spoke in language far too plain and readable.
My condolences.
DM
posted by
Dennison..Mann
on October 5, 2005 at 1:37 PM
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gomedome
be a lawyer, because you have mastered twisting words around and putting words into people's mouths. I tried to have a normal discussion with you several times, and yes, my beliefs got thrown into them, mainly because we were discissing issues that had to do with my beliefs. I tried to understand who you are and why you think the way you do, but even that was replied with unintelligent banter and sarcasm. You rant, ramble, and rave, and that's it.
posted by
CB_Andrews
on October 5, 2005 at 1:20 PM
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gomedome
thanks for clarifying, gomedome. you have once again proved you have an agenda with all of your posts as well. You simply try to piss everyone that disagrees with you off. I simply mis-read something in your post and elaborated on why I mis-read it, and you dive back into bashing me. Thanks for proving you are a childish man who sits on his computer all day, pissed off because he has all these thoughts and opinions and the only people who will listen to him are people he can't see. Get a life, gomedome. Get married, get a new hobby, or something. Because you seem to be a smart person, but you are wasting it here. Your cynicism and sarcasm have bought you no credit, besides the few people here who agree with you.
posted by
CB_Andrews
on October 5, 2005 at 1:15 PM
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CB_Andrews -- Do you notice something peculiar about how you have
dialogued with me since you have been on this site? You never get it, you never understand the contention, you always need clarification. Always.....why do you think that is? Then if not seeing this isn't enough of a nuisance, you drop little snippets of your beliefs on my postings, which are akin to me as someone barfing on my shoes. It's your delusion buddy, don't expect me to support it, especially if you can't even read English.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 1:03 PM
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gomedome
"The horrible aftermath was a result of allowing a misguided set of ideals, based in deep rooted inherent prejudices to run away and grow out of control." I thought you were going somewhere with this statement. It stood out to me. I understood that you were suggesting some sort of hostile revolution by Christians. Either you have to be careful how you say things or I have to not read so much into your comments.
posted by
CB_Andrews
on October 5, 2005 at 12:36 PM
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CB_Andrews -- this must be beyond you -- who mentioned Hitler but you?
The parrallel is in the mindset held by the populace of pre WW2 Germany, Hitler fueled and then exploited these prevailing attitudes but that is irrelevant to the contention.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 12:25 PM
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gomedome
What I am trying to grasp is where you make the connection. Where do you make the connection between a religious group with admitted flaws and Hitler? I will admit the flaws of Christians any day, but not Christianity. Where do Christians discriminate to the degree Hitler did? It is a totally different scale and doesn't even deserve to be in the same discussion.
posted by
CB_Andrews
on October 5, 2005 at 12:04 PM
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CB_Andrews -- again you join into a conversation while not having the
foggiest idea of what is being discussed. No one is accusing Christians of Nazi attrocities here. It is the prevailing mindset, how it is establishing itself and how it is unfolding that has a parrallel to a period in recent history.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 11:58 AM
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gomedome
Are you insinuating that Christians are on a parallel with Nazi Germany? If so, realize that Christians were here long, long before Hitler, and we haven't killed any large groups of people. Not that I can recall. If anything, it was Christians who were persecuted by Jews first. If Christians were going to rise up against those who oppose us, don't you think we would have done it by now?
posted by
CB_Andrews
on October 5, 2005 at 11:44 AM
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Xeno-x -- yep - like ants at a church picnic - there is no end to them
When looking through recent history, the most obvious parrallel of a society trying to build itself up by identifying and persecuting target minorities through a smokescreen of philisophical beliefs, is pre WW2 Nazi Germany. The horrible aftermath was a result of allowing a misguided set of ideals, based in deep rooted inherent prejudices to run away and grow out of control. Sadly, anyone not capable of seeing how they are openly discriminating against others in the name of their religion will never make the connection.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 11:27 AM
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gomedome
might it because for every statement by the more rational, there are a dozen or more by these types of Christians.
They're what brought GW to the WH -- and a few illegal elections in Florida and Ohio.
posted by
Xeno-x
on October 5, 2005 at 11:17 AM
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Xeno-x -- what really scares me about all of this is not a few people
that may or may not have what we can only hope would be fringe opinions, it is how their causes are gaining momentum from ever increasing and widespread support. This can't be good.
posted by
gomedome
on October 5, 2005 at 10:29 AM
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