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Janes
No, she does not know her parents. That has been proven in a court of law. She is just reacting reflexively. She does not smile every time her parents are there. She does not respond regularly. Her reactions are random and meaningless.
Go here to find out some real facts about it all, not the wishful thinking her parents are clinging to in a selfish act of denial.
http://abstractappeal.com/schiavo/infopage.html#qanda
You really have no clue about the facts of this all. Her husband does not even have any real control of things right now. Her brain damage has been getting worse over the years. SHE IS SOMEONE IN A PERSISTENT VEGETATIVE STATE! The only people who do not think so are her parents, who obviously have no respect whatsoever for her. They are putting their own beliefs above what is best for their child and her own wishes. She has no quality of life at all. She will only get worse and worse and suffer more and more if they keep her alive. Her husband and her friends have said she would never wish to live this way.
If someone were on a quad and on a vent and did not wish to live in that state I would back them on being able to die with dignity and show respect for their right to not have to live with such a poor quality of life. I am not saying kill her because she in that way. I am saying allow her to die because she should not be forced to live in such a state if she had made it very clear to those who knew her best that she would never wish to live in such a state.
I know I have no desire to ever be trapped in such a horrible torture as a she must be in. How cruel and heartless a society we must be to allow such torture of trapping someone in a useless body for fifteen years against her will. Luckily I know my fiends and family have respect for me and love me enough to allow me to die with dignity.
posted by
kooka_lives
on March 22, 2005 at 6:58 PM
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Terry's life is not void of all but simple awareness
Kooka, you don't get it! She knows her parents, she communicates with them in her own way, she follows commands, she withdraws from people she doesn't like (hmmm, wonder if that would include her own husband). If she had gotten the rehab SHE WAS SUPPOSED TO HAVE GOTTEN FROM HER DAMNED GUARDIAN OF A HUSBAND, there's a very, very good chance she would be talking more and having an even GREATER QUALITY OF LIFE. Instead, her husband has deprived her of everything but the barest necessities.
And from what you've written, it sounds to me as if you think that someone who is a quad and perhaps on a vent doesn't deserve to live either. The're pretty limited in their functional capacity . . . and yet they damn well deserve to live.
Regarding your uncle who died of a brain tumor, I would venture to guess that he was comatose and truly vegetative and likely did not feel a whole heck of a lot during those last weeks. There's a big difference. Terri is (or was, I'm guessing her condition has plummeted these last few days) able to feel, she can say a few words ("pain," "mommy"), she shows great affection for her loved ones. THIS IS NOT SOMEONE IN A PERSISTANT VEGETATIVE STATE!
But not that you'd ever understand the difference -- or really want to even TRY and understand the difference.
posted by
JanesOpinion
on March 22, 2005 at 5:01 PM
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amdg
If my son was in a vegetative state for fifteen years, then he already died fifteen years ago. I would just be allowing his body to finally die as well.
If Terri wish to eat, then she can sit up and go get herself some food and tell her husband she is hungry and... wait, no she can not do any of that at all. She is in a vegetative state where she is basically a body, void of anything but the simplest of awareness. We can only hope that she has nothing more than that, otherwise her parents have been about as evil and cruel as can be by keeping her mind trapped in a shell she can not use.
In this case it is very much obvious as to what quality of life is. Terri's life has no quality at all to it. She died fifteen years ago. Keeping her body alive is cruel and disrespectful to her. It is about the greatest insult her family can commit.
You are saying that her husband and her friends know her not at all? I truly doubt that. You may claim it hearsay, but it is just as much hearsay that she would want ot live. In this case one has to put faith in those who were closets to her, and looking at the relationship I share with my wife, I would have to figure her husband would be the one to have the best idea as to what she would have wished.
posted by
kooka_lives
on March 22, 2005 at 4:49 PM
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and goody for you about wanting to starve to death
where's the relevance? The point in the Schiavo case is that her so-called wishes are HEARSAY. Find me one case where a convicted killer is put to death on hearsy.
posted by
AnCatubh
on March 22, 2005 at 4:25 PM
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you wouldn't be letting your son die if you withdrew food
YOU WOULD BE KILLING HIM!!!! He wouldn't be dying of a "vegetative state" HE WOULD DIE OF STARVATION. HUGE FUCKING DIFFERENCE.
But it's all good-YOU have decided what a quality life is. How can we possibly have Laws protecting human life if we each of us arbitrarily decide what it is life? If that's how it's gonna be I say "Great! Open season on selfish Liberals!"
posted by
AnCatubh
on March 22, 2005 at 4:21 PM
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Janes
Read my latest post here to see that I have already had to face the possibility once in my life in regards to my mother and I know what she would have desired if she had ever gotten to that state.
You comment makes it clear you have no respect for living life, but instead would rather cause people to suffer. I am all for euthanasia and believe that we need to look into allowing that. There are times when a dignified death is much better than fighting a loosing battle that will only cause more hardships, both emotional and physical. My uncle died of brain cancer at the beginning of last year, and they just let him go. They stopped fighting it and gave him the dignity of dying. He was hooked up to no machines. Of course he had died several weeks before his body caught up to him.
If my son was in a vegetative state and every single doctor in the world said he would never come out of it, I would show respect for my son's life and let him die. I guess I respect life too much to go and rob it of dignity and turn it into some kind of freak show where all that is important is the body. A person is not their body. A person is their mind, once the mind has died the body is just a piece of meat. It is sick and disturbing that we put so much attachment to these pieces of meat that hold us.
posted by
kooka_lives
on March 22, 2005 at 3:37 PM
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amdg
Go read my new post for the answers to all your questions. As soon as I saw your comments I knew I had written the right post.
I would much rather be starved to death than forced to live in a vegetative state, but I do admit we should be much more humane and put her out of her misery all the quicker. Too bad our society seems to have such a problem with the idea of allowing people the slightest sense of dignity in their deaths.
posted by
kooka_lives
on March 22, 2005 at 3:20 PM
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note also that no one is allowing 'piece of meat' Terri to die
They are starving her to death.
For a little insight on what Terri might be going through go to katesjourney.com.
then shut your suck.
posted by
AnCatubh
on March 22, 2005 at 1:34 PM
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And what if that piece of meat was your son --
who happened to be sick, oh let's say, with leukemia. And you lived in the Netherlands and left him alone for a few hours and returned to find him dead. That's the slippery slope of euthanasia. With your reasoning, there's a ton of leeway in determining who is fit to live, and in some countries, even ill children are being euthanized.
Kooka, what you've written makes me want to vomit.
posted by
JanesOpinion
on March 22, 2005 at 6:52 AM
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How, exactly, do you define life?
Can I decide you're nothing but a meathead and starve you? What a gross insult to call this human soul a piece of meat because you wouldn't live in the state she's in. And don't worry about your relatives doing you in when you're crackers. By then it will be mandated by the government.
posted by
AnCatubh
on March 21, 2005 at 7:57 PM
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amdg
Actually I worked in a nursing home for some time and I was horrified by what they kept alive there. There is a very obvious point at which a person is dead, even if their body keeps on functioning. Terri Schiavo should be allowed to die. I have seen the videos they show and her parents are sick people if they believe this is their daughter. They are just holding on because they are unable to deal with the simple fact their daughter is dead, she died fifteen years ago. All they have is a piece of meat which can respond to the most basic, primal responses. It is just body that barely has something of a mind to keep it functioning. I agree that they should be human and find a quicker way to let her die. Her condition is beyond senility or mental retardation because at least in those cases they can do something for themselves. Although I would hope that if I became senile my family would have the simple human kindness to put me out of my misery. Her condition does fit into a level in which we need to be human and give a dignified death to those poor people. She is brain-dead to the level that who she was died fifteen years ago because her brain was severally damaged. She died then. her body is a living piece of meat, but little if anything more.
Although that still doesn't address the simple fact that this is not the business of Bush and his congress. They should not be involved in this at all. Since the husband is the one with all the right it should be up to him to make the final decision and at least it sounds like he is willing to show kindness to his wife and allow her to be able to rest.
posted by
kooka_lives
on March 21, 2005 at 6:12 PM
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hail Hitler!
where should we put the camps to cook the meat?
posted by
chrysalis
on March 21, 2005 at 6:07 PM
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Who does have all the facts?
posted by
Azur
on March 21, 2005 at 4:54 PM
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How can a piece of meat be alive?
I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you don't have all the facts. Terri Schiavo is not brain-dead. She breathes on her own, is capable of limited movement, recognizes her family, laughs and cries. Her brain damage makes it difficult to swallow hence the feeding tube. The feeding has been removed. She will die of thirst and/or starvation. Death Row criminals are killed more"humanely".
"All the BS about how she responds to voices and such is meaningless since it's obvious she's not coming out of this" Brilliant. You just provided the argument for euthanizing the senile and mentally retarded. Way to go, Goebbels.
posted by
AnCatubh
on March 21, 2005 at 4:37 PM
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Kooka, that's your choice. The danger is that it sometimes means people respond to the tone of the language rather than the points made.
I read closely, many people only see the surface
posted by
Azur
on March 21, 2005 at 4:21 PM
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MayB
I guess I did misunderstand. I read your post and saw that you basically did agree. I thought you were trying to say I had used shocking language in my headlines to get attention and over did it.
posted by
kooka_lives
on March 21, 2005 at 4:14 PM
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You misunderstand me. I was responding to your earlier commenter who appeared shocked by your post. I am saying that the content is not at all shocking. I think that he could not see past your emotive language. If you read my post you will see it is along similar lines to your own
posted by
Azur
on March 21, 2005 at 3:54 PM
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MayB
Being quiet is no fun at all. I like be loud here myself. I am one who really says nothing unless I have something to say, then I try to make sure I am heard.
posted by
kooka_lives
on March 21, 2005 at 3:47 PM
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This content is not shocking. Your emotive language may shock some. Please see my Quiet Blogger post
posted by
Azur
on March 21, 2005 at 3:38 PM
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Wow Kooka!
I am just gonna leave this one alone.
I'll just stand back and watch the fireworks; which are sure to be headed your way...LOL 
posted by
David1Spirit
on March 21, 2005 at 3:22 PM
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