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'fraid not. It's all a myth. No sheer stockings either!
posted by
johnmacnab
on May 10, 2005 at 4:41 AM
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Mayb,
I apologize for being so flippant. I hope you didn't take it the wrong way. I don't want to get on your last nerve here.
posted by
Blanche.
on May 9, 2005 at 5:10 PM
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Mayb,
Which part? The "taking the opening and running with it"? or "shoot me"?
posted by
Blanche.
on May 9, 2005 at 4:54 PM
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Maryx, that's probably closer to the truth than you know
posted by
Azur
on May 9, 2005 at 4:52 PM
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Mayb,
Sorry, I couldn't resist. I saw the opening and took it. Shoot me.
posted by
Blanche.
on May 9, 2005 at 4:51 PM
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Ha, ha mary x
posted by
Azur
on May 9, 2005 at 4:49 PM
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JohnMcNab & Mayb?
What? You mean Canadian lumberjacks don't wear high heels just like dear old Papa?
posted by
Blanche.
on May 9, 2005 at 4:48 PM
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Billy and Ms N Dependence, I think we have a hand in perpetuating our own stereotypes particularly when we can make a $ from it
posted by
Azur
on May 9, 2005 at 4:14 PM
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MayB
You're right about the expected stereotypes, MayB. I have yet to meet a Canadian lumberjack.
posted by
johnmacnab
on May 9, 2005 at 3:57 PM
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Great post MayB
I agree somewhat with Billycargo's comment.
posted by
Transcendental_Child
on May 9, 2005 at 2:21 PM
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Mayb,
I'm reminded of a funny postcard I saw once: "Leave your baggage at home", meaning cultural baggage. We can't, of course, so trying to find some common ground for disccusion is the best.
posted by
Blanche.
on May 9, 2005 at 12:46 PM
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Good post but I disagree with your assessment of stereotypes:
stereotypes are rooted in cultural assessments of one culture made by another culture over a period of time. I see them as historic first impressions, usually bad ones. But I see them as having some foundation in truth. Its up to us to realize they are only the thinnest venner of what a culture is actually about and it is our choice to scrape the surface and find out the larger picture. If we choose to travel into someone elses culture this choice becomes an obligation.
posted by
FreeManWalking
on May 9, 2005 at 8:33 AM
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I haven't read the post in question, but I certainly don't remember having to be careful about conversation while in England or any of the other countries we visited. Most people are willing to talk about a variety of things.
posted by
Ca88andra
on May 9, 2005 at 6:04 AM
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MayB
I agree, talk about anything you like. It,s not what is said so much as how it's said.
posted by
WileyJohn
on May 8, 2005 at 11:00 PM
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Of course now some people find it easier to hate everyone
posted by
Azur
on May 8, 2005 at 10:10 PM
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L.E.Gant. This is what I mean in my second paragraph by "how" you ask. The examples you cite highlight how the stereotypes are preserved
posted by
Azur
on May 8, 2005 at 10:10 PM
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It's not the questions that are the problem. It's the attitude that goes with the questions.
I remember, when I lived in Paris (around 1960), how the French loathed American tourists. Why? Because every question (good thing to ask) was accompanied by a comment about how americans would have done it better. Germans were almost as disliked,for much the same reason.
Asking is important, butmake sure you don't askin a way that implies "being better". (Like "does this quaint HOTel have a bathroom and does it serve beer cold as it should be in a civilised country?")
posted by
L.E.Gant
on May 8, 2005 at 10:08 PM
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or even among potential friends
posted by
Azur
on May 8, 2005 at 9:34 PM
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"Sometimes we have to leave our safe places and walk empty handed among our enemies." It's a quote from the old TV show Beauty and The Beast. Your post reminded me of it.
posted by
tigerprincess
on May 8, 2005 at 9:23 PM
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Moreover, that kind of travel behavior will teach the perceptive
tourist to recognize ideosynchrasies from their OWN cultures.
posted by
ARGUS
on May 8, 2005 at 8:06 PM
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Ginnie, this was my other blog but now it is my main blog. If you look back a couple of posts you will see what my daughter said. It is an early version of what your daughter said
posted by
Azur
on May 8, 2005 at 6:02 PM
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I'm with you MayB...
..though just by nature I'm cautious about offending anyone when I'm visiting (or living in) a different country. I test the waters first before I jump in. And sorry...I didn't realize you had another blog!
posted by
ginnieb
on May 8, 2005 at 5:46 PM
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Mary x, it is though talking about the "little" stuff that we find the bigger truths
posted by
Azur
on May 8, 2005 at 5:25 PM
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Katray, it is far better if those who are different are humanized even if their political views are misguided or naive ;-). The world is in worse shape because those who are different are dehumanized
posted by
Azur
on May 8, 2005 at 5:24 PM
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sorry - there is no need to avoid all dialogue because of fears of overstepping the mark
posted by
Azur
on May 8, 2005 at 5:23 PM
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FactorFiction, there are always exceptions and you have highlighted one. As I said, how people go about getting to know others will have a big impact on how they are received -- ie people calling others strange when it is strange to them. Although some subjects are taboo or difficult, there is no need to shut ourselves for fear of offending. We must test the boundaries and usually it works out just fine.
posted by
Azur
on May 8, 2005 at 5:22 PM
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Interesting post May
I get to experiment with having civil discussions about politics and religion in my hometown. Works pretty well, so far. I have friends who are pro Bush and family members who believe the Christian right is right. By sharing our views openly and without rancor, we really do learn from each other. Amazing how much closer in goals and ideals you often are to those who seem so "out there."
posted by
Katray2
on May 8, 2005 at 5:12 PM
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Mayb,
We hear all the time "never discuss religion and politics", but what two subjects could be nearer to anyone's heart? But still, when traveling, I've found that what people most often seem to end up discussing are similarities and differences in culture: the common everyday life, like work, pay, housing, things to buy, food, etc. I don't think anything should be taboo, if it's done with respect.
posted by
Blanche.
on May 8, 2005 at 5:05 PM
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I'm not sold on this MayB
this is part of what gets Americans the reputation of being rude...not knowing what is acceptable where... in some cultures certain things are just not allowed. Heck, the Hacidum aren't allowed to touch a woman not of their house since they cannot be sure she is not menstruating and unclean. Do you really think that all topics could be "tastefully" brought up? In a perfect world maybe.
posted by
FactorFiction
on May 8, 2005 at 5:04 PM
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J.King, thank you. This is the exactly the kind of stereotype I mean. Your response should be, "I never heard that before" although some will never get it
posted by
Azur
on May 8, 2005 at 4:46 PM
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Great post! you know, everytime someone asks me "what I am" meaning where am I from, or my race, when I say half Cuban half white, more times than not I always get some dumb response that includes something about Fidel Castro. Geez, I don't know the guy, I am American, born here blah blah blah. I know most don't do it out of meaness, but geezzz. Stereotypes just suck whether they are offensive or not.
Go Easy,
Ja
posted by
J.King
on May 8, 2005 at 4:26 PM
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