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Re: Re: Kabu
posted by
Kabu
on August 11, 2016 at 7:39 AM
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Re: Re: Aba
You have raised excellent analytical points. I was merely considering Emna as one with a mental disorder, Obsessive Compulsiveness/or Obsession, less severe than the full-blown mental illness of Masochism. However, I tend to agree with you. But such finer points obscure the issue of how women were perceived, the realities for and of women then, and the popular writing styles of the period. He wrote a great story. Very, very good thinking. 
posted by
Sea_Gypsy
on August 11, 2016 at 1:05 AM
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Re: Re: Aba
The within is indeed, so much the richer than the without. Exactly so, dear Presta. 
posted by
anib
on August 11, 2016 at 12:12 AM
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Re: Aba
There being two types of mentally distorted; sadists and the masochists, Emma could be categorized a masochist because she found pleasure in inflicting pain on herself, and thus she could conceive romantcsm in suicide. An even worse form than that of Emma's can be found in Ibsen's Hedda Gabler. She believes a bullet through the head is aesthetically superior to that of a bullet through the stomach. They do appear wierd. The 19th century novelists and playwrights used fully developed neurotic female protagonists in their stories which, probably a decade later, Freud researched on. Your query is therefore, natural and thought provoking.
posted by
anib
on August 11, 2016 at 12:08 AM
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Re: Kabu
The plight of the women are similar in almost all societies. So, during the 18th and 19th centuries sensitive writers did take up their cause in the form that were realistic and not fictional. Bput so far as real reformers are concerned, imo there were none so great as Swami Vivekanada and Raja Ram Mohan Roy. The effect is only now being felt, though the ups and downs makes the society to step backwards.
posted by
anib
on August 10, 2016 at 11:32 PM
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Re: FSI
Quite true. Such questions do get raised naturally. thanks.
posted by
anib
on August 10, 2016 at 11:23 PM
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Re: Aba
Aba, forgive me for not focusing on the point, and focusing on Flaubert, and what is considered his masterpiece. You have done a wonderful job of describing the story. He, of course, wrote a magnificent story!
I like your last line. Many artists withdraw into themselves, at least for a time. It is perhaps because self-reflection is a way to replenish the spirit, and allow the ability and desire to return to the "real" world. Writing is, imho, a solitary art where one at times does seem to 'live in one's head,' so to speak, in order to better focus upon how to express that art. Balance is the key. Marvelous job! 
posted by
Sea_Gypsy
on August 10, 2016 at 9:27 PM
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Aba
I am considering this on many levels. First, I wonder how accurate Flaubert could be in his depiction of addressing a woman's motivations, thoughts and resultant actions, albeit only in fiction. Again, given the time in which it was written, I must concede to having as little knowledge as anyone else about that! LOL. My personal opinion is that there is absolutely no romance in suicide, nor such thing a romantic suicide; there is only suicide. But tragedy, romance, and all the other elements in this story have made it one of the better known and studied. Sounds like a case of a bit of an obsessional mental disorder for the poor Madam, but who knows? Well told, Aba.
posted by
Sea_Gypsy
on August 10, 2016 at 8:51 PM
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My take from your writing is that this woman was no different to the frustrations of so many women in so many societies. if you have other things to do besides being seen as someone's wife and Mother, the first thing many women will /would do is to have an affair or two . bankrupt their marriage both finacially and morally.
True freedom of expression is less so now for a woman of course, but even when I was a girl the future was mapped out with marriage and children and so she probably like me, married the guy who would marry her and give her children only to realize how boring and mundane life stretched out ahead.
posted by
Kabu
on August 10, 2016 at 10:20 AM
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Reading this makes me think about suicide in literature, and with the economy being what it is, about debt as well.
posted by
FormerStudentIntern
on August 10, 2016 at 5:33 AM
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