Comments on You are what you eat. Guess what you're eating?

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That's fuckin' scary...

...and if that doesn't motivate people to be more aware of their environment, both natural and political, then there is a serious problem with the state of the union.

-Ek

posted by Ekildog on December 6, 2003 at 3:47 PM | link to this | reply

Adults don't tolerate lies and corruption from their government.

Adults don't have to whine but the American Revolution was about a "redress of grievances" not whinning.

Are you opposed to the American Revolution? How about the Republicans spending $70 million to persecute President Clinton about a Whitewater 30 year old land deal? Was that whinning or merely vicious and vindictive politics at the expense of the taxpayers?

Grown ups face reality and deal with it. Juveniles avoid responsibility or push it off on someone else just as Bush and the Republicans are doing with the national debt. How can you justify tax cuts to the rich while the federal budget is ballooning out of control? Time for adults to retake control of the US government like Dean and Clark.

posted by spyinthesky on December 5, 2003 at 8:45 AM | link to this | reply

SpyInTheSky, Adults Also Refrain From Seeing The World In Ideal Terms. And

adults do not ever whine and cry about the big, bad bogey men in such places as the White House, major corporations and the military.

When a person is truly an adult, he or she is so busy doing such "adult things" as seeking ways to become more self-reliant, to improve his/her status, to make more money, and to provide for his/her family that he/she does not have the time to carry out adolescent little 1960s-style crusades against the "Establishment."  

posted by Feenix on December 5, 2003 at 8:27 AM | link to this | reply

We need to go forward, not back.

I certainly wouldn't want to return to the 19th century much less go further back. What I'm saying is that there is no question that new technologies can gradually assume the burden of fossil fuels and in the process provide clean, renewable, non-polluting energy that will last forever. We need to go forward as fast as our brains can carry us.

Fossil fuels are finite and someday will be exhausted. Adults plan for the future.

posted by spyinthesky on December 5, 2003 at 8:07 AM | link to this | reply

Spyinthesky, Way Back In The Mid 1970s, Many Made The Prediction That

the world would run out fossil fuels in about 20 years, or by the 1990s. And here we are today, with plenty of oil to go around. And we haven't even tapped the vast oil resources in northern Alaska yet.

The truth is, even though I have conservative views, I hate what is happening to the nation's environment and wish the entire country was as pristine as it was in 1600s and before. I love such things as vast expanses of greenery untouched by human hands, clean air and clear lakes, ponds and streams.

In fact, if it were up to me, all of us would be living in the same fashion as the American Indians were when the first Europeans set foot of these shores.

posted by Feenix on December 5, 2003 at 7:10 AM | link to this | reply

MHW missing the point.

No one is suggesting that we have to go back to life in the 19th century and abandon all the modern innovations of indoor plumbing and motorized transport. What we are suggesting is that there are numerous energy efficiencies that can be achieved that would reduce our dependency on fossil fuels and simultaneously reduce pollution. This could be done with tax credits for those who make energy efficiencies as was done in the 1970s(instead of Bush's idiotic  and wasteful tax cuts for the rich).

Fossil fuels will run out in 20 years or so. Adults plan for the future. We should be developing alternative energy resources like solar, wind, hydrogen, etc. Not doing so is not only irresponsible but juvenile.

posted by spyinthesky on December 5, 2003 at 6:52 AM | link to this | reply

SpyInTheSky, It Does Not Matter What Kind Of Car You Drive Or How Much You

caulk the windows of your home and the such. By using modern machines as automobiles, gas stoves and PCs,  you are doing your part to strip the earth of its natural resources to contribute to the high levels of pollution.

If I ever decide that excessive damage is being inflicted on the environment and that the levels of pollution are far too high, I will have the courage to drop out of modern life, move way out to the mountains, and live off the land.

But for so long as I live the good life by doing such things as driving an automobile (whether or not it gets good gas mileage), cook my meals on a gas stove, preserve my food in a refrigerator, cool my home and office with an air conditioner or electric fans, have my clothing dry cleaned, and take a hot shower every day, I will never complain about the damage that is being inflicted on the environment by the oil, coal and nuclear industries.  

posted by Feenix on December 5, 2003 at 6:37 AM | link to this | reply

BrWiSk, When It Comes To Protecting The Environment and Making Attempts To

reduce pollution levels, there are tens-of-thousands -- maybe even hundreds-of-thousands -- of people in the US who practice what they preach.

They live in rural areas or somewhere way out in the woods where they do not ever drive automobiles or use electricity;  and where they expend only enough natural resources (e.g. lumber, water, plant life, animals) to provide for their basic needs.

In my opinion, anyone who constantly uses or takes of advantage of such modern conveniences as automobiles, hot and cold running water, indoor plumbing, microwave ovens, PCs, telephones, gas/electric ranges, refrigerators, air conditioners, oil/natural gas heating, electric lights -- and who live in communities with paved streets and sidewalks, and in homes constructed with large amounts of lumber, steel and concrete, have no business complaining about the damage that is being inflicted on the environment and the high levels of pollution that are present today.

Ted Kazinsky might be "crazy" and committed some "unforgiveable" crimes by murdering various people, but when it came to his arguments against the environmental damage that was being caused by modern industries and the over-consumption of natural resources, he, at least, practiced what he preached.  

Furthermore, human beings do not even have the capability to do such things as "save the environment," "to rid the world of pollution," or to "save the oceans." For so long as human beings inhabit this plant, about one of the only things that will ever "clean up" the earth is 40 days and 40 nights of continuous, heavy, pounding rains.

posted by Feenix on December 5, 2003 at 6:20 AM | link to this | reply

MHW can't face facts.

I drive a Honda Accord that gets very good mileage. I plan on buying a hybrid car next time to cut down further on use of fuel. I have done and used every energy saving device including caulking windows and putting in extra insulation in the attic. There are many things that Americans can do to make us a much more energy efficient country and it would also reduce our dependence on foreign oil (we import 60%) and cut pollution.

There is simply no excuse for Bush and the Republicans to allow their major contributors to add more coal dust, more Mercury and more radioactive waste to our environment. These damaging pollutants can be reduced, it just means that the energy companies who produce them will have slightly less profitability. In a sane and uncorrupt America that would be a reasonable trade-off. But not in Bush's America.

posted by spyinthesky on December 5, 2003 at 6:12 AM | link to this | reply

ShawnMichel, It's Real Tough Being An Adolescent, Isn't It.

posted by Feenix on December 5, 2003 at 5:41 AM | link to this | reply

MHW

Think about this, will you, my friend?

It is impossible not to be a hypocrite in this world when we decide to decry its countless travesties.

Many of us are forced, for instance, to have to drive cars to get where we need to go. And many of us must do many of the other things you, MHW, mentioned.

Do you do these things? Of course you do. What if you were to realize, one day, that these things are wrong. Would you be able to drop all these activities immediately and go live in the woods? I doubt it.

Most of the rest of us couldn't, either.

Why in the hell does that mean we have no right to criticize these things? Are we not in fact especially qualified, as people who must cede to this wasteful, polluting version of modernity, to call it what it is?

What is it?

Well, for you right-wingers out there who don't think we need the environment and don't think we should try to stop war when it threatens our very survival, let me spell it out for ya':

It's bad. Real f'n bad. And we had better stop calling each other names and get down to the big task at hand of saving this place where, just in case you haven't noticed, we all have no choice but to reside.

posted by BrWiSk on December 4, 2003 at 7:09 PM | link to this | reply

Never Mind MightyHolyWingnut

...he put too much starch in his brown shirt this morning while listening to Jerry Falwell.

 

Your post is an excellent one, as usual.

 

Shawn

posted by ShawnMichel on December 4, 2003 at 6:57 PM | link to this | reply

SpyInTheSky, Since You're So All Fired Up Over Pollution & The Environment,

I assume that your means of transportation is a horse and buggy;  you do not ever take hot showers or baths;  you do not ever have your clothing dry cleaned;  you cook all of your meals over camp fires;  you illuminate your home with candles;  you heat your home with a fireplace, using only discarded papers and rags for fuel; you do not ever use gasoline, plastic or any other petroleum products;  you do not ever use natural gas;  and you do not use a PC to send your posts to BN but forward them there via pony express.

posted by Feenix on December 4, 2003 at 3:56 PM | link to this | reply

indeed

I've actually read some scary stuff about the Third World War being planned all along, ever since the first one. The idea is that a good 4/5s of the world's population will be killed off and a master-slave economic system replete with dictatorial government will be implemented in the war's wake.

That sounds too conspiratorial for me, but the logic seems to be there, i.e., if the world's population reduces to 1 billion, give or take a few hundered million, all the types of pollution we currently emit won't have the same impact. It makes sense at first blush, that is; the biggest polluters curently are the first of our planet's many billions.

But...I won't delve into any more conspiracy theory for now. ...

posted by BrWiSk on December 4, 2003 at 1:54 PM | link to this | reply

They tell themselves, "it doesn't matter."

Bush's rich friends are making so much money (and skimming off the top and giving it to Bush and the Republicans as a "thank you" bribe), they tell themselves, "it doesn't matter."

All the science says that in the long run it definitely does matter. But in the "long run" we are all dead anyway - according to Bush economists, so why worry about it?

It is immoral and criminal but there is no one to stop them - yet.

posted by spyinthesky on December 4, 2003 at 1:14 PM | link to this | reply

What is the matter with these people?!?!?!?!?!?!?

It's enough to make you want to scream.

This folly is beyond me. What is their problem?!?!?!?!?!?

posted by BrWiSk on December 4, 2003 at 1:05 PM | link to this | reply