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Janed, The Black Rights movement was filled with violence at every stage
And King may have been for non-violent protesting, butt that did not change the fact that when people are being treated poorly, they are going to get upset and angry. In fact that video had a lot of the same feel as videos from the black rights movement. King's followers did lose control and act aggressively at times.
What I saw in the video was a lady who decided to go into a group and basically pick a fight with them. They took her cross and stomped on it, but did no harm to her. I'd say that was a lot of self control on their part. But basically she walked into situation where she had to have known she would upset the people there and et an aggressive response from them, since the protest was anti-prop 8.
Marriage as it has been for 5,000 years? Marriage ahs NOT remained the same for the last 5,000 years. It has changed every so often as society has needed it to change. Marriage now is NOTHING like what it was 5,000 years ago. Back then the church had nothing to do with it and it was more or less a personal thing, depending on the beliefs of your culture. Polygamy has been very much accepted during different periods of time in human history. According to the Bible all one needs to do for a divorce is for the guy to say he is not happy with his wife and he can walk away from it all.
If you have no problems with 'civil unions', which would just be renaming marriage, then the issue is only in what you call it and becomes really silly. Since in truth you are for them getting married as long as they call it something else. Basically unless you can show a real difference between marriage and a 'civil union' then you kill your own case here. If all you care about the title given to it, then you have no real problem with what is actually being asked for.
posted by
kooka_lives
on November 14, 2008 at 8:26 PM
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Re: Re: I don't condone violence
Well, considering that over 900 of the recognized 1200 human cultures in history practiced some form of polygamy, and that I have ancestors who practiced polygamy only a little over a hundred years ago, I have some trouble with keeping marriage as it has been. I consider polygamy mostly a way of empowering men to exploit women.
And I find the scientific evidence for a biological origin of homosexuality conclusive, not slim. Granted, no one has identified a specific gene involved, but several solid biological differences between gay men and straight, and between lesbians and straight women have been found, and strong evidence of genetic correlation has been found. These are the first steps toward learning the mechanism, but stand as proof of the biological nature of the trait.
But I have no objection to civil unions if gays accept them. Except for that disproved concept of 'separate but equal'. Constitutional problem? You betcha.
posted by
mousehop
on November 14, 2008 at 5:27 PM
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Re:
sam444, I can believe it's hard being different, ie gay. There are many who have successfully changed thanks to counseling. I have a number of patients who are gay/lesbian. It is my desire to show them the same respect I would anyone else. For sure, violence is never the answer to any problem!
posted by
JanesOpinion
on November 14, 2008 at 1:08 PM
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Re: I don't condone violence
Regarding the supposed biologic findings supporting homosexuality, mousehop, from what I've read of the research, it's a slim case in favor and in general the results are rather conflicting.
You're right about STDs and lesbians. That's a given.
Last I knew, gays are treated as full citizens. If they wish to legalize their relationship, then why not fight for some sort of legalized civil union? Keep marriage as it's been for over 5,000 years, and instead provide them with a civil union.
I vote for YOU, mousehop, to get on your soapbox and fight for this!
posted by
JanesOpinion
on November 14, 2008 at 1:06 PM
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I enjoyed this article! I have a brother who is gay and his life has been difficult! I just try to be tolerant, but violence is never an answer! sam
posted by
sam444
on November 13, 2008 at 5:09 PM
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I don't condone violence
But I do disagree with some of your post. No doubt, gays are in general more promiscuous than heterosexuals, but that is hardly an excuse for persecution. There is also a growing body of evidence that points to homosexuality as being biological in origin, with both genetic an hormonal components, and completely out of the control of the individual. So unless you can show harm to society, you cannot justify unequal treatment under the law. Simple promiscuity is hardly equivalent to harm, however objectionable you may find it.
And if you want to base an argument on, say, STD's, you might have a case against gay men, but you lose badly among lesbians, who have a lower rate of STD's than heterosexuals.
So my suggestinos would be that we enforce the laws against violence, and then start treating gays like full citizens.
posted by
mousehop
on November 13, 2008 at 4:03 PM
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Re: JanesOpinion
Justi, it may well require a miracle!
posted by
JanesOpinion
on November 13, 2008 at 11:14 AM
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Re: I saw that video........
Corbin, i think you're right. Decency has departed the building. . . .
posted by
JanesOpinion
on November 13, 2008 at 11:13 AM
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JanesOpinion
I don't know if we can pull the scraps together aftetr this election. Prayer is so necessary now. Be blessed.
posted by
Justi
on November 13, 2008 at 2:06 AM
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I saw that video........
The fringe elements will be emboldened to behave more and more in this fashion with the election results.......
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on November 12, 2008 at 6:59 PM
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