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- Go to THEIR HYPOCRISY ALLOWS THEM TO INTERVENE WHEREVER THEY SEE FIT.
Thanks, Offbeat
Well said counterpoint!
posted by
Krisles
on
May 30, 2005
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2:07 PM
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Limey
While pointing out that America has intervened in the Latin American country's you fail to mention just what type of intervention it was. First we built roads in many of the countries. While traveling to the Carribean nations for updating their system technology, the people were grateful for what we were doing. Roads that had been under construction for years in Jamaica were completed by the US within a few months. I have seen many American food bags with " A gift from the American People" on them. These people were grateful for receiving this generous gift. As far as other Latin American countries , many have requested the US intervention in order to curtail drug problems. Many of these people are killed by those who would stand in the way of the different cartels. Many Americans were killed trying to sort it out as well. You always have to put a negative slant on what America does, but let me tell you something, we damm near feed the whole world and teach those who don't know how to feed themelves are gratful that the best best country on the planet cares enough to help them. Your a real piece of work slime, I mean lime.
posted by
Offy
on
May 30, 2005
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1:59 PM
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Beware!
Look out Limey. I'm taking notes. Maybe you're next!! Heh, heh, heh.
posted by
Burly
on
May 30, 2005
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1:24 PM
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kingmi
See my comment on your post.
posted by
Limey
on
May 30, 2005
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12:10 PM
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Zen
Thanks for your long and interesting comment.
I agree with you that Britain behaved appallingly in the past and does so even now. However, this blog's about America.
As you might imagine, I would have hoped the US might have learnt from British mistakes. But that hasn't happened.
Now - as Americans did for Britain in the past when she was world leader - we, and people in the rest of the world, must point out the error of your ways.
posted by
Limey
on
May 30, 2005
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12:09 PM
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Ends of the Earther
You're right about the Sudan.And, yes, they're still debating.
posted by
Limey
on
May 30, 2005
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11:58 AM
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Ends of the Earther
The American Empire will stall when starved of petrol. And, yes, it's a little chilly over here now that the sun has set.
posted by
Limey
on
May 30, 2005
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11:57 AM
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Tigerprincess
Sorry - I'm not quite with you. Please elaborate.
posted by
Limey
on
May 30, 2005
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11:52 AM
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Dylan
I don't accept your premises.
I believe it is for the United Nations alone to decide where and when to intervene.
I believe it is impertinent of America to assume it alone knows best what is/what is not right for any sovereign, independent country.
And for the sake of argument, I believe America would be mightily offended - to say the least - if Great Britain, for example, were to decide it should attack and occupy your country. (Incidentally, I'm positive I could put forward a hundred reasons why America is unfit to govern itself and poses a threat to world order).
posted by
Limey
on
May 30, 2005
at
11:30 AM
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Limey, Hysterically funny today! Hahahahahaha!
http://www.blogit.com/Blogs/Blog.aspx/kingmi4293/
posted by
kingmi
on
May 30, 2005
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11:17 AM
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Ends of the Earther
Firstly, thank you for your thoughtful and well considered comment. It is heartening to know there are still people like you in America.
Secondly, please let me stress that I do not regard all of you as hypocrites - far from it. But I would suggest the majority - those of you who voted for Bush - are just that.
You are right to draw parallels with Nazi Germany. If you recall, like America, it also housed a large, silent minority - one that looked on in silence as Hitler exterminated Jews and other minorities.
Today, in the eyes of billions worldwide, Americans are behaving in a similar fashion, and done so for generations. And that is precisely the reason your countrymen and their activities are widely hated.
Yes, I realise the truth hurts. But it has to be said - and, as the messenger, I will not apologies for that.
PS I have not read the Downing Street Memo in detail; however, I am awar of its main points.
posted by
Limey
on
May 30, 2005
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11:13 AM
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Ms N Dependence
I was at one of my local pubs enjoying a quiet pint (or two) of Ridley's Prospect. And, of course, time flys when you're having fun.
posted by
Limey
on
May 30, 2005
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10:30 AM
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All Empires Fall
Yes that empire upon which the sun finally set.
posted by
Ends_of_the_Earther
on
May 30, 2005
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8:16 AM
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Does the Sudan have Oil?
No. So, it is doubtful we will be racing over there. Are they still debating the definition of genocide?
posted by
Ends_of_the_Earther
on
May 30, 2005
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8:13 AM
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Actually Limey darling
Liberalists,and those with more conservative views are often on the oppisite sides of the fence. I'm not sure where you're coming up with your information.
posted by
tigerprincess
on
May 29, 2005
at
10:11 PM
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Overall... quite on the mark
But I think it's also quite indicting of governments in general. I mean, the US does act in its own best interest most of the time, but I don't really see much of a difference in its behavior and the behavior of most other governments. Sure, the US is the "Big Kid on the Block", but history shows that such power is a damned-if-you-do-and-if-you-don't proposition. One case in point could be: Britain.
During its heyday and it's imperial decline, Great Britain was in just the same predicament as the US. No matter what it did, not everyone liked it. In fact, a great many nations on the earth detested it. The same can be said for France. The same can be said for many others. It's just now the shoe's on the other foot, so to speak.
Yes, the US does run rough-shod quite a bit over the interests of others, but I don't really see how it's behavior is too much different than that of any other "superpower". I find it interesting I don't hear much of what Russia and the Soviet Union used to be up to -- especially in Europe. The US's famous foil is now relegated to obscurity, just as its remnants are working to pick up the pieces -- and as some are worried, go in the same nationalist direction.
I wonder how the world would be if Britain had not worked so vociferously for the real estate from Eastern Europe though the Middle East to India, upsetting legitimate regimes, funding bandits and fomenting unrest against properly-elected and/or historically-legitimate rulers. I especially wonder how things would be different if Philby hadn't been so successful working with Ibn al-Saud and the Wahhabists in garnering the support of the Crown, in the government's work to stabilise the Arabian peninsula.
It's fine to poo-poo on the US for the things it does/has done that are underhanded and selfish. Just don't think that the British Parliament and Windsor have their hands clean, either, that anyone does. I have many reasons for my desire to leave the US, and the issue you raise is indeed one of them, just a minor one.
posted by
zenresistance
on
May 29, 2005
at
9:50 PM
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Just as an intellectual exercise, consider these premises: If you accept that
1) there are circumstances in which intervention could be justified -- that is, in oppressed nations or ones experiencing genocide, where military action (i.e. Rwanda or Sudan, if we had chosen to intervene) would have saved many more lives than it took; and that
2) though intervention may be theoretically justified in several cases at once, a nation may find it infeasible to intervene everywhere, so may rightly choose one over the others, following the same logic that would lead us to cure some sick people even though we cannot cure them all; and that
3) economic considerations are legitimate factors in contemplating foreign policy, though they admittedly should not trump concerns over basic human rights, then...
you are stuck accepting that a military intervention by the United States, even if motivated partly by business/economic interests, is not necessarily wrong. Consider for examples Bosnia and Kosovo, in which international action stopped genocides and thus saved more people than the NATO bombings killed; indeed, we could have and should have saved more lives by intervening sooner.
Our hypocrisy in the past does not, in my view, make it right to countenance a policy of benign neglect toward people in, say, Sudan, suffering from mass murder, where our intervention could only make things a lot better. Whereas we have many times intervened on the wrong side and for deplorable purposes, that does not make it wrong to intervene in present and future on the right side and for humanitarian purposes, even if we maintain economic incentives for doing so.
posted by
Dylan24
on
May 29, 2005
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8:10 PM
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Very true
I couldn't agree more butfor one point. Our foreign policy clearly indicates shameful opportunistic, imperialistic, and elitist behavior. I think our current president called most hard working Americans the "meat loaf class." At caimpaign finance dinners he is on camera welcoming "the other half." The one who were most like him and would help him buy the election. The people [he] wanted to be with.
Frankly, my family taught me, as did many of my friends family's, to lend a hand when needed, right wrongs when I could see them and always treat others as I would desire to be treated. I am ashamed of our image throughout the world if this is the perception of us by so many. In my life, I have been very close to a great many Englishmen (and women), have had them in my home as good friends, aboard my vessel in the middle of the Pacific Ocean, and have shared their friendship over 15 years. I won't play into a prejudice. However, I will say that the number of Americans who were uneducated enough to believe the right wing rhetoric and vote away their civil liberties in 2004, not to mention their way of life, while choosing to continue being hated throughout the world is pathetic.
There are a great number of us who do not want this kind of image because we do not represent the leadership and frankly, despite the constitution, they do not represent us. We can vote. Sure, but we can't make the hoodwinked masses see the light even when you show the pictures and unfortunately most are too preoccupied with economic survival to care or get involved.
Its sad. You draw many correct conclusions and there is far more evidence to support your claim than you present. However, it is not fair to label ALL Americans as hypocrits. Many Americans are leaving the US because this silver spooned monster and his neo conservative Christian extremist chronies are taking over the government. The parallels to the Nazi's of the 1930's are striking. Goebbels once said that the leaders need not be concerned with convincing the intellectuals of their cause but rather the average working class people. They can be swayed by playing on their emotions and their simplistic predjudices. You see the mob is what makes the majority. The few who control the wealth in this country are in charge. With thier wealth they will manipulate the media, play upon ignorance and walk all over the "will of the people." Again, our government has been a shame. Did you read the "Downing Street Memo?" Perfect evidence that Bush planned to go to war while he was telling the American people he would go only as a last resort. I will quote it when I get the copy from my father's office. However, it is not all of us. I know its not me and I appologize for our leaders and our inability to come up with better ones.
posted by
Ends_of_the_Earther
on
May 29, 2005
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7:58 PM
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Limey--Unfortunately I cannot argue with this...
posted by
Renigade
on
May 29, 2005
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7:18 PM
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Limey
What are you still doing up?
posted by
Transcendental_Child
on
May 29, 2005
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6:53 PM
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spatrick
Who else can vote? British? Chinese?
posted by
Limey
on
May 29, 2005
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5:48 PM
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Not entirely true...have you seen the problems we have with our voting the last few elections?...And then again we only have the choices given to us...although I've heard humors that cartoon characters have won the majority of votes for years and years...President Micky Mouse???
posted by
spatrick
on
May 29, 2005
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5:42 PM
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spatrick
Only Americans have control over America and American politics. It's up to you.
posted by
Limey
on
May 29, 2005
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5:40 PM
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You seem to assume that the American public supports such actions when in reality said Americans actually fall into four catagories: blissfully unaware, non-supporter, supporter, and politician. (And it should also be know that most Americans have poor oppinions of politicians...the one who wins office is usually the one who pretends to be the least evil)
posted by
spatrick
on
May 29, 2005
at
5:37 PM
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