Messages To Liberals, Atheists And Other Dummies > Comments on LEGALIZED ABORTION: It Is Leading To The Destruction Of Black Society

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I have a few questions

As I read your argument, then the follow up, logistically it seems the Sexual revolution proves your point more than legalized abortion.  Had one not happened, there would have been no leap to the second.  If you're going to trace it back, and you did, wouldn't that be the root cause.  Even with AIDS and a proliferation of diseases, what was once a revolution seems to have continued as business as usual for the next generation.  How do you undo a Sexual revolution?  Can revolutions be undone except for another revolution of sorts?

I'm not sure of the statistics nowadays, but for a long time Baltimore was tops in sylphilis and teen pregnancies.  Norplant came into play, not forced, just offered as an alternative.  Yes, the best alternative would have been for teen females (and their partners) to stop, but, of course, that wasn't going to happen.  And even if it were curtailed, it wouldn't have made a big enough dent in the problem as quickly as it was needed, so health officials and educators approached it from a two-tier position, the first being Norplant.  The rates have gone down significantly, and abortion rates haven't gone up.

Teens who get pregnant generally have little regard for their own health, let alone what may or may not happen to a baby.  Some don't even figure out they're pregnant until they're well along the way.  A baby is born, often addicted to something or into a home where aunts and uncles may be the same age.  That's not much of a start, and it most assuredly will continue a cycle.

I've scoured many adoption sites. By and large it's Black children, usually past the infant age (making them less wanted for adoption), and most often in groups of siblings.   A neighbor whom I looked into adopting at the death of his last adopted family member, came out of a home with 4 brothers and sisters; all but one ended up on the street.  He had been an infant when all five were taken from his mother.  They were given back, then taken again.  This boy had all sorts of awful physical problems, and he was very lucky that he was adopted by a wonderful mother in North Carolina.  His brothers and sisters weren't that lucky, and he has seen them by chance over the years. 

This woman definitely was a woman who should not have had a child, let alone five.  I can speak to this one personally because I watched it along with this boy.  She popped back into his life when he was around 5.  I thought the adoptive mother was incredibly strong as she more or less gave the boy the choice to go with his birth mother even though he had been her son for four years.  The boy said he didn't know the woman and wanted to stay with his adoptive mother.  (The adoptive mother died of cancer, and he came to live with her sister in Maryland, my next door neighbor.  The aunt died of cancer as well the next year.)  He made the right choice, as the mom disappeared from sight again, and didn't make an attempt to get any of the other children, according to the adoptive family who kept in contact.

So, theory is okay to deal with, but when you look at the small-world, real-life cases, you look more at what can be done immediately without causing long-term harm.  So, if you don't believe in abortion, what's your alternative? 


As always, I have a feeling some will interpret my questions or  my gender to determine my stance on abortion.  Don't. You'd be wrong.  I wouldn't get amnio tests when I was pregnant with my son because it wouldn't have made a difference in any decision I would have made. So, I'm asking the questions because they need to be asked in relation to this just to clarify the position, that's all.

posted by terpgirl30 on May 13, 2005 at 4:47 AM | link to this | reply

Then we must respectably agree to disagree. If it must be narrowed down to one specific moment in recent history that hasten the descent, I contend it was the crack epidemic that hit in the eighties. Regardless, I refer back to my original premiss. With strong, positive self-images as individuals and as a people, no social movement such as the Sexual Revolution, no landmark decision such as Roe v. Wade, or even an onslaught of illegal drugs could have such a negative impact.

posted by Talion on May 12, 2005 at 11:34 PM | link to this | reply

FWMystic, you're right. But are you aware that Hispanic girls between the
ages of 15 and 18 have the highest rate of abortion in the country. So, it's blacks today and y'all tomorrow, especially those Hispanics who have large numbers of blacks in their populations, such as Puerto Ricans, Dominicans, Panamanians and Cubans. And one of these days, they're going to get around to exterminating thousands of those chaparitos y chaparitas who are currently sneaking across the border. So, don't gloat, ese.

posted by Feenix on May 12, 2005 at 10:55 PM | link to this | reply

They be getting busy ...
but us Mexicans are winning the demographic war.

posted by fwmystic on May 12, 2005 at 10:47 PM | link to this | reply

FWMystic, please cut out the sarcasm. Even though more than a half-million
blacks males are incarcerated, there are still enough of them running free to irresponsibly impregnate black females.

posted by Feenix on May 12, 2005 at 10:45 PM | link to this | reply

How are all these black women getting pregnant ...
with all the black men in prison?

posted by fwmystic on May 12, 2005 at 10:43 PM | link to this | reply

Talion, I will not go into a lot of detail here. But I will say this much.

back in the day when I was a hoodlum and "gang-banger," I, as well as most of my homeboys carried guns and some of us even had such high-powered weapons as military-style automatic rifles and sawed-off shot guns. But back in the day, and even though we were nothing but common street thugs, we followed a strict code of conduct. We had a strong sense of right and wrong which kept us from doing such things as hijacking cars, bustin' caps on innocent people just to take a few dollars off them, or carrying out drive-by shootings.

About the only times a hoodlum used a firearm back in the day was when his back was up against the wall and he had not other choice but to do so, or we he was holding up a store or some other enterprise.

But largely because what is commonly referred to as the Sexual Revolution and the legalization of abortion that grew out of that "revolution," a great many Americans no longer have a sense of honor; nor do they have a sense of shame. And that applies to large numbers of the "good," as well as large numbers of the "bad."

In other words, beginning in the mid-1960s, an atmosphere of permissiveness and a "feeling of no shame" emerged in this country, and the flood gates were open. A "Pandora's Box" situation occurred. Once it was officially proclaimed that it was just fine and dandy for people to have "sex with no strings" and it was acceptable to murder unborn human babies, a whole lot of people started going wild.

No matter what anyone else says, I contend that if the "Sexual Revolution" had never occurred in the US., and the the killing of unborn human beings would never have been legalized, this nation would be far more civilized than it is today.

In summation, the legalization of the murder of unborn babies has caused a great many people in this nation to have little or no respect for the sanctity of life -- and as a result, and opposite of what used to be the case, we are watching a never-ending parade of car hijackings and drive-by shootings in the "ghettos," innocent little girls getting snatched off the streets and raped and murdered, kids going to their schools and gunning down large numbers of their classmates, women tossing their newborns into garbabe cans, and I could go on.

Thus my stating that the legalization of abortion is currently at the root of blacks' higher-than-average rates of violent crime and othe social problems are not a "stretch" at all.

It is the truth. 

posted by Feenix on May 12, 2005 at 10:36 PM | link to this | reply

     I won't question the affect abortion has on black society, but to say, "Every one of the deadly social problems plaguing black society today grew out of the legalization of abortion..." is a stretch. Think about the times when you were younger, running with the gang and what not, before Roe v. Wade. Think about those who stood with you and those who stood against you in rival gangs. Imagine what it would've been like had there been an abundance of automatic weapons at your disposal and even more highly addictive illegal drugs derived from plants that aren't indigenious to the United States. Now add a gangsta rap soundtrack that glamorizes and glorifies what transpires and a billion-dollar media industry eager to sell as much of this bullshit that society can be duped into buying. Correct me if I'm wrong, but your time would be the same as this time and legalized abortion is nowhere in sight.
     When I was in college, I took a psychology 101 class. I remember a segment on conditioning of the mind. Along with Pavlov's dog, there was also a feature on how elephants were trained in a circus. When they were babies, the handlers would chain them to a stake in the ground. The young elephants would try as hard as they could to break the chains, but to no avail. They simply weren't strong enough yet. Once they realized this, the baby elephants stopped trying. They gave up. As they elephants matured, the thick heavy chains were replaced by a rope. Yes, an ordinary rope, the likes of which and elephant could break if it sneezed, but the elephants never did that. They would feel the loops around their legs, assume they were the chains they couldn't break from so long ago, and never bother to try to break free. In essence, they were trapped not because their bonds could not be broken, but simply because they believed it.
     This, above all else, is the problem that plagues our people. Too many of us have given up. Too many of us have lost hope. Too many of us have stopped loving ourselves as individuals and a people. This, not legalized abortion, is the problem that all the others spring from. A man who truly loves himself would not sell or use illegal drugs. A man who truly loves himself would not be so anxious to kill another human being for something so trivial as a pair of sneakers or for wearing the wrong color. A man who truly loves himself would not rob or rape or feel the need to prove his manhood by fathering a slew of babies from an equal number of different women. A woman who truly loved herself would not be content to exist on public assistance or be so easily seduced by some wanna-be "player." People who love themselves have hope and the willingness to do whatever they can to forge a better life for themselves and their loved ones. People who love themselves get educations and decent jobs, build stable families, and thriving communities. If black people as a whole loved themselves, all the other problems would vanish immediately.               

posted by Talion on May 12, 2005 at 9:51 PM | link to this | reply

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