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Hmmm, Interesting. . . .
And let me guess, Damon, you're a know it all expert on everything pertaining to American politics and furthermore are one of those blokes who knows everything about every subject pertinent to mankind, eh? And then some? Never wrong? Always got to have the last word? I'm guessing you're a Michael Moore fan, and likely have his 9/11 crockumentary memorized word for word? Now there's a scary bit of inaccurate information propagandised across this country. You're right -- if I get my info solely from mainstream American media such as NBC, I'd have less than half the story. Fact is, though, I get my info from a variety of more reliable sources, all of which concur that the exit polls were exceedingly inaccurate, and that Pres. Bush did legitimately win re-election. So please get over it, will ya? Oh and by the way, I read your "Stop the Wars" blog, and question how accurate all your info is. Don't forget that Kerry had 10,000 lawyers in place to monitor for election fraud; overall they enjoyed a fairly boring day. Bullocks, bollocks, bull headed, whatever.
posted by
JanesOpinion
on December 12, 2004 at 11:42 AM
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The Ohio...
...debacle is about far, far more than just exit polls, as you'd know, if you had access to an even half-decent media. Those polls may be inaccurate, but there's much more to the story. Watch 'STOP THE WARS' for more, if you're interested.
The BBC 'research' was clearly self-serving. Come up with a scary conclusion, then make a programme to fill the percieved gap. I know, just from the kids and teachers I come into contact with on a regular basis, that the underlying assertions are, as I stated originally, bollocks (two 'o's, by the way, and no 'u').
But there's nothing more I can add to this discussion now.
D
posted by
DamonLeigh
on December 12, 2004 at 4:00 AM
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Hello
posted by
1965stories
on December 10, 2004 at 9:10 PM
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Come off it, Damon.
Damon, I just read one of your posts on American politics in which you discuss the "accuracy" of exit polls and how the actual vote count in the State of Ohio must have been fraudulent -- because the exit polls were surely accurate. And now you're talking about how a sampling of Britons is inaccurate, most likely because you don't like the results of the polls. You'll argue back by stating that the BBC poll was inaccurate in that the "researchers" wanted results that would support their conclusion. And I had questions about the way the exit polls in America were conducted -- especially since they polled during the day when more women were inclined to vote and were more supportive of Kerry. So that poll was flawed -- and yet you stated it was accurate. Fact of the matter is it would seem you approve of polls that support your opinion, but think other polls are "bullocks" if they don't support your opinion. So much for your ideals of scientific reasoning!
Don't tell me about primary sources. Even primary sources and study results can be flawed and you know it. You'd likely find fault with a source that came directly from the principle researcher -- if the results were such you don't agree with. I stand by my opinion of your arrogance.
posted by
JanesOpinion
on December 8, 2004 at 7:09 PM
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Just...
...I DO live in Britain, and I'll be back there tonight, just so's you know.
I also know a fair bit about that period of our history (though I'm too young to have been there). It was certainly good that America did finally get off it's lazy, inward-looking ass three years after the war began and got involved, though any veteran I've ever spoken to agrees that the myth of "rescue" is one that has grown up in the comfortable times since the war, when, like tales of a bar-room brawl, the stories grow in size and scope with every passing year.
We appreciated your help - when it finally came - but we'd have won without you. But it would have taken longer, and cost more lives.
BTW - what's this got to do with how many kids know about the Holocaust??
D
posted by
DamonLeigh
on December 8, 2004 at 6:32 PM
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Jane...
...well. I don't FEEL defensive! I'm just pointing out how nonsensical that "research" clearly is from my own perspective. And, BTW, your link is to someone talking about his research (which, as I've already pointed out, was very self-serving) and not to the research itself. Surely as a Masters lady, you know the importance of primary sources?
Oh, and I've never cast doubt for one moment on the horror of the Holocaust, or the importance of never forgetting.
D
posted by
DamonLeigh
on December 8, 2004 at 6:27 PM
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Many thanks,
Justsouno, for your support. If you're ever up around the Great Lakes area, let me know. That cup of tea and talk offer is still on the table.
I'd be glad to hear a WWII perspective from someone who lived through it.
posted by
JanesOpinion
on December 8, 2004 at 12:14 PM
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Jane
This is for DAMON on you comments page. One thing I would like to ask you Damon? How much do you know about how America came to your rescue when you were being bombed and having to run for cover like street rats nightly. I lived through that period and I am not senile, un-educated or enjoying your angst toward a woman who will not lie or stir a story against you country or ours. If you do not live in Britain go home.Sorry for the bedsheet size comments page mine does that sometimes.
posted by
Justi
on December 8, 2004 at 10:23 AM
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Jane
| This is for DAMON on you comments page. One thing I would like to ask you Damon? How much do you know about how America came to your rescue when you were being bombed and having to run for cover like street rats nightly. I lived through that period and I am not senile, un-educated or enjoying your angst toward a woman who will not lie or stir a story against you country or ours. If you do not live in Britain go home. |
| |
posted by
Justi
on December 8, 2004 at 10:22 AM
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Damon
You're just peeved because I attacked your country. Why be so defensive? Americans are usually the butt of just about every negative political comment or bad joke, so for something negative to be said against Britain -- just be thankful it doesn't happen on a regular basis. I am the first to admit that polls and research can be skewed every which way. Heck, I just finished my Master's degree with all the requisite research and such and would be the first to acknowledge that skewed results happen. And you bring up a good point that immigrants from particularly Asian or Muslim countries (and I know Britain's getting a lot of them) would very likely not have a clue about the Holocaust. However, your insufferable arrogance does not sit well with me. The fact is, humanity -- the peoples of the world -- should NEVER forget the horrors of the Holocaust. We must never stop learning from that awful event.
posted by
JanesOpinion
on December 8, 2004 at 10:02 AM
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I Also Read...
...that link more carefully.
Especially this bit.
"We were amazed by the results of our audience research" says series producer Laurence Rees. "It's easy to presume that the horrors of Auschwitz are engrained in the nation's collective memory but obviously this is not the case.
"We were particularly startled by the fact that less than 40% of younger people have even heard of Auschwitz.
"The research reinforced the importance of making this series and trying to ensure the atrocities that unfolded at Auschwitz are never forgotten." (italics mine)
He needed to get the BBC to commission him to make the series that was his idea, and pay him for it. So he went out and did research that confirmed the need for the series to be made. It would have been kinda daft of him to have done research that suggested that making the series would be a waste of time, wouldn't it?
THINK!!!!
D
posted by
DamonLeigh
on December 7, 2004 at 8:47 PM
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I Did Some Checking...
...with friends with school-age children, and they all knew about the Holocaust. Non of them are hugely gifted, academically, and are what I would consider typical. Even if they missed it in school, there's often stuff on TV about it, usually around November time or around some significant anniversary. Next year, there'll be a lot, for example. Oddly, a lot of those will be made and carried by the BBC.
I'm not saying you're wrong to put so much store by a survey of a thousand people...No - actually, I AM saying you're wrong. Maybe they asked a representative mix of people with senile dementia who can't remember their own name, recent immigrants who have a completely different history, and three-year-olds!
D
posted by
DamonLeigh
on December 7, 2004 at 8:43 PM
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Damon,
That's a piss poor excuse of yours "I'm a brit and I know it." Yeah, and I'm a Michigander and I know everything too. Not. Before you trip over your over-arrogant big foot, let me give you the link to your very own BBC to read for yourself: http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2004/12_december/02/auschwitz.shtml
Anybody should know that polls are not perfect; however, they do give an indication of where a group of people (i.e. in this case, Britons) could stand to ramp up their knowledge or, in the case of the Holocaust, take some Gingko to improve their memory.
And if a survey was done showing Americans to be equally as amnesic in their recollection and knowledge of such awful events, I would certainly make the same recommendations as I did for the Brits.
posted by
JanesOpinion
on December 6, 2004 at 8:43 PM
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The Basis...
...of this post, the survey, is, I can assure you, utter bollocks.
I'm a Brit, and I know it to be so.
It would help a bit if you could provide a link to said survey.
It may also help to remember that this survey declares that 45% of a population of almost 60 million are ignorant of the Holocaust, but of those 60 million, how many people were asked? Typically, just over 1,000. They'll tell you it was a randomly chosen and representative sample, but samples can easily be skewed, deliberately or otherwise, and questions can be loaded.
But with all this in mind, let us have the link, and we can take it from there.
D
posted by
DamonLeigh
on December 5, 2004 at 8:20 PM
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Taps,
I'm afraid to find out how ignorant we Americans may be. I hope the numbers haven't reached 45%.
posted by
JanesOpinion
on December 3, 2004 at 8:06 PM
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JanesOpinion - Do you know what are the statistics for that in the U.S? It is hard to believe that no one is teaching them about the death camps and what happened. WOW. How could they not. Now I must ask my teenage grandsons what they know about that. I would be horrified if they do not know.
posted by
TAPS.
on December 3, 2004 at 7:51 PM
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I hear you, Just so, and can understand why you're not a liberal. Thanks for posting!
posted by
JanesOpinion
on December 3, 2004 at 1:59 PM
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Jane
Of course you have read some of my posts on Here Comes The Kid, so you know I am of an age to have a first hand experience with that incredible happening. This is why I am not at all liberal. I once was and I grew up and looked back and remembered.
posted by
Justi
on December 3, 2004 at 11:32 AM
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Yes, I did a report on the Jewish Holocaust in my High School German class, and it's something you can never forget once you see the photos.
posted by
TARZANA
on December 3, 2004 at 10:58 AM
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